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Does anyone still think the old time heavyweights were too small to be competitive in the modern era?

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    - - Lotta smallish anthropoids defiling this board.

    For reference to the actual subject as a point in fact, Dempsey's retirement was only a few years before Louis debut. Dempsey's primary pre pro boxing was in mining camps, bars and saloons, often bare fisted when not with unpadded skin tight leather gloves as Kid Blackie. Joe was a storied Amateur in the middle of The Great Depression when he turned pro to much acclaim. Jack much younger than Joe, his first recorded weight was around 160, where at his retirement he was in the 190s. Joe slightly bigger overall turned pro in the 180s where he maxed out at 220s at retirement as a much older fighter than Jack.

    Coming up today, they'd likely have current ama and backgrounds before turning pro at a uniform age of say 20. I'd say Joe could dry out to start at LH for a title before moving to cruiser that he would dominate much like Usyk before moving to heavy, say age 24 debuting at 215 and maxing out age 36 at about 235.

    Jack could make supermiddle drying out, then LH, and then Cruiser, and then Heavy where he turns pro around 210. What with the $$$ being made for two KO artists heavy, I'd say he maxes at 225 much like Usyk.

    I'd also say what with the International ama and pro boxing explosion, they would be subject to more talent than in their day, yet still able to carve out excellent careers as exciting heavies.

    Comment


      Originally posted by ShoulderRoll View Post
      You listed a fighter who was 185 lbs.

      Any reason you keep ignoring that?

      Comment


        Originally posted by Bronson66 View Post

        Matt McGrain said it,I don't have his email but ,as you pretend to be able to post there ,"when you want",why don't you do just that and ask him?
        Here is McGrain's post about you.
        I made the mistake of allowing Mendoza back here from his ban,It was a bad mistake , but it will never happen again.

        Clear enough for you?


        I have had 2 usernames on ESB Mcvey and Tonto,and 2 here Ivich and Bronson.

        You have little time for me? I hate your ****ing guts!

        I SAID MOD'S, plural! You bring up one a Scottish little drunk? Just one? Your drinking mate?

        I asked for his email, and you don't have it? You say you only registered twice at EBS and here? Why need to register twice
        or 5 times with different poster names? I say it rhymes with canned. As in you were BANNED many times. But you know that.

        Press on with your hate, it keeps you going in a sad type of way The real Bronson was Britain's most notorious prisoner BTW. Interesting 8th chiose for a poster name.

        I've had enough fun with you for now.

        Comment


          Originally posted by Dr Z View Post


          I SAID MOD'S, plural! You bring up one a Scottish little drunk? Just one? Your drinking mate?

          I asked for his email, and you don't have it? You say you only registered twice at EBS and here? Why need to register twice
          or 5 times with different poster names? I say it rhymes with canned. As in you were BANNED many times. But you know that.

          Press on with your hate, it keeps you going in a sad type of way The real Bronson was Britain's most notorious prisoner BTW. Interesting 8th chiose for a poster name.

          I've had enough fun with you for now.
          Why would I have his e mail,I've never met the man?
          Neither have you met him so how do you know he is a drunk? He is thought highly of in boxing circles,whereas you are despised on ESB

          I said I have had 2 User Names on each forum and that is true.

          Still saying you aren't banned from ESB?
          Below is your avatar,now redundant.lol

          Hrgovic = Next Heavyweight champion of the world.banned



          Matt McGrain has his own You Tube vlog and is a boxing writer,published in several ****zines.






          Matt McGrain, a boxing historian, analyst, and lifelong student of the sport, is a writer for East Side Boxing, Boxing.com, and The Sweet Science. McGrain lives in the Highlands of Scotland.

          You shouldn't have any trouble contacting him,except we both know you won't try to! lol

          Here you go!
          "Mendoza can do what he likes on Boxing Scene. Let's not let the horrendous mistake I made in bringing him back spoil any more threads."

          Matt McGrain ESB Jan 25th 2023
          Last edited by Bronson66; 12-31-2024, 07:00 AM.
          Biledriver Biledriver likes this.

          Comment


            Originally posted by ShoulderRoll View Post
            - - 280 ain't many beating 200+ lbs in a marathon, but Fat Boys 244lb Areola and 266 lb Kawnacki set all time Compubox records in 2019:

            Arreola's 1125 punches thrown were the most by a heavyweight in CompuBox's 34 year history/The fight broke records set by for most punches thrown and landed in a heavyweight fight...

            Comment


              Originally posted by QueensburyRules View Post

              - - 280 ain't many beating 200+ lbs in a marathon, but Fat Boys 244lb Areola and 266 lb Kawnacki set all time Compubox records in 2019:

              Arreola's 1125 punches thrown were the most by a heavyweight in CompuBox's 34 year history/The fight broke records set by for most punches thrown and landed in a heavyweight fight...
              This observation makes rather a nonsense of claims about Marciano.

              Comment


                I think it depends on the HW. I can't see Tommy Burns, Marvin Hart, Fitzsimmons, Tom Sharkey, Jeannette, Braddock, Wills, Johannsson, competing at HW today. Fitz, Sharkey, Jeannette would be more competitive at 175 or cruiser. I think Dempsey, Louis, Charles, Tunney, and Liston could all compete today at HW. Not sure how much would be lost coming up over 200 pounds for some of them. Dempsey had an interest in martial arts and may have ended up as an ATG MMA fighter today. Not sure about Marciano. I think he would struggle at HW today, he would be successful at Cruiser though.
                Bronson66 Bronson66 likes this.

                Comment


                  Heavyweight is unique in boxing because there is no weight limit.

                  It's far easier to rank fighters in other divisions because they are exactly the same size.

                  There is a lot of delusion amongst a certain section of boxing affictionadoes that fighters who would be natural light-heavies or cruisers today (most cruisers are bigger than pre-liston champs with the exception of slow, lumbering, unskilled Willard and Carnera) could beat the most skilled of modern super-heavies.

                  Not happening.

                  Greatness and head to head in the glamour division are very different things.

                  The only heavy champs from the past (with modern nutrition so around 10-20 pounds heavier today) that could compete in the modern era (from Tyson) are Louis, Liston, Ali, Foreman and Holmes (with apologies to Frazier).

                  Jusr my opinion.

                  Comment


                    Originally posted by Anomalocaris View Post
                    Heavyweight is unique in boxing because there is no weight limit.

                    It's far easier to rank fighters in other divisions because they are exactly the same size.

                    There is a lot of delusion amongst a certain section of boxing affictionadoes that fighters who would be natural light-heavies or cruisers today (most cruisers are bigger than pre-liston champs with the exception of slow, lumbering, unskilled Willard and Carnera) could beat the most skilled of modern super-heavies.

                    Not happening.

                    Greatness and head to head in the glamour division are very different things.

                    The only heavy champs from the past (with modern nutrition so around 10-20 pounds heavier today) that could compete in the modern era (from Tyson) are Louis, Liston, Ali, Foreman and Holmes (with apologies to Frazier).

                    Jusr my opinion.
                    In my opinion your opinion is not based off any real
                    evidence at all. It simply makes 0 sense that bulking up can make you a better boxer. Nor has it ever even manifested in any era. Not even the modern era. A former cruiser is champ right now. Even if you cling on the to idea that he bulked up - it doesnt change the fact that his oponents have 50 lbs on him and 6 inches of height.

                    its a total
                    myth. You can’t prove it. You can easily find fights in all eras of smaller heavies crushing big heavies.

                    its a pointless argument. You pretty much have to be a casual to succumb to your argument sorry to say

                    Comment


                      Originally posted by them_apples View Post

                      In my opinion your opinion is not based off any real
                      evidence at all. It simply makes 0 sense that bulking up can make you a better boxer. Nor has it ever even manifested in any era. Not even the modern era. A former cruiser is champ right now. Even if you cling on the to idea that he bulked up - it doesnt change the fact that his oponents have 50 lbs on him and 6 inches of height.

                      its a total
                      myth. You canât prove it. You can easily find fights in all eras of smaller heavies crushing big heavies.

                      its a pointless argument. You pretty much have to be a casual to succumb to your argument sorry to say
                      Then answer the question I have asked you a dozen times.
                      Why did
                      Ellis
                      M Spinks
                      Moorer
                      Holyfield
                      Haye
                      Usyk

                      All added weight to compete successfully at heavyweight?


                      How many of Usyk's heavyweight opponents have had 50lbs on him and 6 inches in height? 1

                      Once again.

                      E X A G G E R A T I O N

                      Comment

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