Manny Pacqiuao a Top 25 all time great??

[IronDanHamza]

I don't care for Ali as a person.....I just can't allow my personal distaste for him color my perception of him as a fighter. I admire Louis I freely admit

Poet

Yeah, joking aside my personal dislike for him doesn't effect my ranking.

He's an amazing fighter, amazing.

I just rank Louis higher for the specified reasons

[SCtrojansbaby]

You really have no clue what you're talking about.

At all.

Ali worked with King on certain events, Arum on others. Beyond that, most top Heavyweights have historically fought less. That's been the standard for most of history. Ali didn't set anything. Johnson, Dempsey, Marciano...none fought 10 a year. The wear was too much and the purses too good to need that many fights. Ali's decade in the 70s was high on activity with 4 fights each in 75 and 76 (after his association with King started). He went to two fights in 77 and 78 when he was generally shot.

When Robinson aged and could command top dollar (after his first retirement), he fought less too for many years. If fighters were paid their real value, instead of the inflated HBO prices paid out too often to guys who can't fill a flea market, you'd see more club shows featuring 'that guy I saw on HBO.'

Reguardless King & Arum were setting up big pay days and building fights months in advance rather then have guys fight 6-12x a year

My other point still stands as well, boxers don't choose to fight more or less the market dictates how much you fight. Prehistoric boxer had to fight more modern fighters less.Obviously guys who are fighting 3x as many fights are going to have better resumes the market was different and that is why its dumb to compare the eras.

And yes as much as you want to fight it athletes have progressed by leaps and bounds over the past 60 years, that is a fact. There are a handful of exceptions but by in large Bigger Stronger Faster Better Athletes today. and yes Boxers are athletes.

Boxing fans much like Soccer fans are stuck in the stone age baseball hockey football etc fans all recognize that the guys of this era are better.

[JAB5239]

LOL so you think if Ray Robinson fought today he would be the only guy in the sport choosing to fight 10x a year and if Pacquiao fought back then he would be the only guy fighting 2x a year?

It is the sport of boxing today they fight less, it was the sport back then fight more. That is why its dumb to compare 2 completely different eras.

The point is that those guys proved they were durable enough to fight all the best and much more often. Manny, as great as he is has not. You want to compare them to today's standards instead of holding today's fighters to the standards that have already been set by past greats because fighters today CHOOSE not to fight as often. That is a twisted logic that makes no sense to any kind of objective and open minded person.

And by the way, you've conveniently ducked all my questions.Why is that?

[Sam Donald]

Greb
Wilde
Monzon
Gans
Gavilan
Fitzsimmons
Griffith
Walker
Tunney
Jofre
Napoles
Ketchel
McLarnin
Walcott
Ross


why are all these fighters ranked ahead of manny pac? im not saying they aint but some one please individually point out something from there career that has them ahead of pacquiao??

[Sam Donald]

i amnot saying they are not great, yes some of them are ranked ahead of him but not all

[Barn]

i amnot saying they are not great, yes some of them are ranked ahead of him but not all

You can't expect someone to do all those fighter pick out 1-3.

[Sam Donald]

You can't expect someone to do all those fighter pick out 1-3.

the last 3

McLarnin
Walcott
Ross

[Sam Donald]

You can't expect someone to do all those fighter pick out 1-3.

this is for u

[Barn]

this is for u

Thanks for that bro had me in stitches.

I'm watching the Rangers vs Celtic game so once its finished I'll get back to you.

[crold1]

And yes as much as you want to fight it athletes have progressed by leaps and bounds over the past 60 years, that is a fact. There are a handful of exceptions but by in large Bigger Stronger Faster Better Athletes today. and yes Boxers are athletes.

Boxing fans much like Soccer fans are stuck in the stone age baseball hockey football etc fans all recognize that the guys of this era are better.

The only place in boxing where that would be measurable is speed and, like any era, some have it and some don't. A Welterweight is still a Welterweight. 147 lbs. (or 160, or 118) are constants. When fighters are bigger below Heavyweight, it is only because of a change in the weigh-in rules (meaning they weigh more at fight time than they used to...still hit the scale the same).

As to your baseball example...funny how a change in rules on, um, vitamins has seen so much of the 'progress' of the last 20 years is regressing back to an increase in small ball and base running.

Different sports have different variables.