Armstrong vs. Duran @ 140

[QueensburyRules]

Absolutely... Sometimes the best offense becomes the best defense as well...

- - See young Mike Tyson for a better example of that before King and Givens ****** all the life out of him.

[them_apples]

Okay, but Armstrong is not what I think of when defense is being discussed. What flims do you think Amstrong shows good defense in making a man miss / blocks well, or uses his feet for defense? I am asking you.

For a fighter who stays in the pocket the entire night for 15 rounds, Armstrongs defense is of the highest caliber. He may have the most missed punches of filmed boxing of all time. Extremely hard to hit thats why he never got koed. Was he ever even dropped?

[them_apples]

I Look at a few things and realize some general principles:

1. Look at Armstrong's perpetual angle to the opponent, and look at where he is. From this information one can see he is not in range.
2. Look at what the opponent is doing, moving backwards usually, making any shot trivial.
3. Realize that the hand being quicker than the eye means a lot of punches the judges assume, whether they actually land, or not... And look at the effect of the punch itself, both points to me indicate, based on Armstrong's look, that he is not getting caught. Even pressure fighters stop moving when they get tagged good.

All these points mentioned are in virtually any film of Armstrong... You just have to look for them and use logic.

Absolutely he uses angles to turn 99 percent of the leathers coming at him into glancing blows. Combine that with smothering and the punches have almost no effect at all.

[them_apples]

Okay, but Armstrong is not what I think of when defense is being discussed. What flims do you think Amstrong shows good defense in making a man miss / blocks well, or uses his feet for defense? I am asking you.

Every single film of him is just that, slipping and ducking punches

[Willie Pep 229]

For a fighter who stays in the pocket the entire night for 15 rounds, Armstrongs defense is of the highest caliber. He may have the most missed punches of filmed boxing of all time. Extremely hard to hit thats why he never got koed. Was he ever even dropped?

Twice.

Zivic stopped him on a TKO in their second fight.

In their first fight Henry went down but the referee called it a push.

And of course there is his legendary match-up with Al Lovino, the night Armstrong matched the extraordinary feat of the great Benny Leonard.

That night Armstrong went down like Duran against Hearns, face first and out.

Two stoppages over 15 years and 190 bouts, not too shabby.

[them_apples]

Twice.

Zivic stopped him on a TKO in their second fight.

In their first fight Henry went down but the referee called it a push.

And of course there is his legendary match-up with Al Lovino, the night Armstrong matched the extraordinary feat of the great Benny Leonard.

That night Armstrong went down like Duran against Hearns, face first and out.

Two stoppages over 25 years and 190 bouts, not too shabby.

Good to know. So Armstrong was put out one time?

[QueensburyRules]

It is a difficult match-up to think through because Armstrong style (using his head) would not carry today.

In today's world, Duran would constantly complain and the referee would have to take some sought of action.

If they met in 1938 it would be interesting to see if Duran could adjust to the constant head fouls.

But the game has moved on in technique and Armstrong's behavior would not be acceptable today.

It, like so many cross-era fantasy match-ups, just isn't a realistic fight to evaluate.

- - Duran more likely to flatten Henry's protective cup...just sayin'...

[billeau2]

Absolutely he uses angles to turn 99 percent of the leathers coming at him into glancing blows. Combine that with smothering and the punches have almost no effect at all.

You box, you have been hit, I got tagged a plenty in martial arts... While both of us can look at an excellent pressure fighter like Lamotta, or the recent Pitbull Cruz, and marvel at their methods, we both understand that no matter how "tough" someone is, they cannot just take full punches consistently and like portrayed. There has always been methods for taking blows when inevitable, or to set up some other counter.

[billeau2]

Twice.

Zivic stopped him on a TKO in their second fight.

In their first fight Henry went down but the referee called it a push.

And of course there is his legendary match-up with Al Lovino, the night Armstrong matched the extraordinary feat of the great Benny Leonard.

That night Armstrong went down like Duran against Hearns, face first and out.

Two stoppages over 25 years and 190 bouts, not too shabby.

Jeez... Can you imagine the superstition that could have risen if... oh lets say on both those rare Ko's Armstrong had fish for supper and the head was pointing towards him... or he walked under a ladder on both nights...

[Dr. Z]

For a fighter who stays in the pocket the entire night for 15 rounds, Armstrongs defense is of the highest caliber. He may have the most missed punches of filmed boxing of all time. Extremely hard to hit thats why he never got koed. Was he ever even dropped?

That is a good question.