Pac: Skills vs Juice - you tell me

[jrosales13]

Why should anyone blame Pac for the fighters he fought?? or accuse him of PED? You can go into a fight and be an overwhelming favourite (De la Hoya/Pacquiao) and end up getting your behind kicked. I think Pac has been matched carefully since he fought Morales and i would like to see how he does against Mayweather or Guzman type of style but to be honest there isnt a lot of boxers around with a fighting style like that in around Pac's weight so all he could do is fight the best opponents available.

Do you mean Morales or Marquez?

[MayMosPeaHop]

Thats fair. But at the same time4 he's moved up in weight where the overwhelming percentage of fighters aren't as skilled as JMM. And at the same time he has shown improvement in his game. Do we blame Pac for the fighters he's fought? Accuse him of PED's? Or do we accept the fact that he's gotten better? Not faster, not stronger, but more polished?

Your first statement in regards to a overwhelming percentage of fighters not being as skilled as JMM, I agree with, but that does mean that there are not fighters out there between 135-147 who have a similar or superior skill level in comparison to JMM. And do not get me wrong, I do not have a problem with matchmaking or going for money.

And again, Do I see improvement? How can I tell? Do I think Manny has learned more? Yes, but I will not be able to measure his true progression until he fights a fighter on the same skill level or has a superior skill level than JMM.


I do not blame Manny for the fighters he fought. Money comes first.

[JAB5239]

Why should anyone blame Pac for the fighters he fought?? or accuse him of PED? You can go into a fight and be an overwhelming favourite (De la Hoya/Pacquiao) and end up getting your behind kicked. I think Pac has been matched carefully since he fought Morales and i would like to see how he does against Mayweather or Guzman type of style but to be honest there isnt a lot of boxers around with a fighting style like that in around Pac's weight so all he could do is fight the best opponents available.

You're a great poster Ray, I respect your objectivity.

[Ray*]

Im also su****ious. But Im not going to judge a fighter on what I don't know. Im also going to take into consideration the circumstances of the situation. I thought 14 days was a good agreement. Pac turned it down. At the same time I have to think if I am Manny why would I let ANYONE dictate the terms of a fight to me when I am the p4p top gun and they've already gone about slandering me? People talk about the money. Pacquiao already has enough money so his great grand kids can live comfortably. Pride though, pride is forever. Thats just MY opinion though.

I dont mind pride and am sure 90% of boxers today have the biggest pride and egos in the world so manny having his pride is okay for me, But pride was never mention when the excuses were been made on why he wouldnt fight without random testing, And none did anyone mention "Dictate" the terms of the fight to me.

We all knew how many excuses was made and none were to do with the word "Pride" or "dictate".. More to do with "Scared of needles"... "I need 30 days"....."I get sick"..."I would be blood drained"....and the new one (Jimmy Kinnel show) "He's bigger than me so the test would affect me more than him"

Now if he had said from the begining till NOW that "Pride" i would be behind manny 100% but i cant see any other boxer getting away with something like this and i seriously cant see Mayweather getting away with a single excuse from the manny excuses list.

[Ray*]

Do you mean Morales or Marquez?

Morales, JMM might be a techincal boxer but he also like to brawl which is great for Pac style-wise.

[amonb]

lol yah pacs real amazing now. he beat up an over the hill weight drained hoya. cotto who was never the same after getting his ass whooped by margarito and still made him drop an extra 2 pounds to drain him. ricky hatton who was never the same after getting whooped by floyd. and david diaz lol.

So when he ****s out mayweather what excuse have you got for him then????

[Ray*]

You're a great poster Ray, I respect your objectivity.

You too Jab, Me and you have arguments/difference of opinion all the time without name calling or childish back-chats thats why i respect you as a poster along with Jrosales.

[JAB5239]

I dont mind pride and am sure 90% of boxers today have the biggest pride and egos in the world so manny having his pride is okay for me, But pride was never mention when the excuses were been made on why he wouldnt fight without random testing, And none did anyone mention "Dictate" the terms of the fight to me.

We all knew how many excuses was made and none were to do with the word "Pride" or "dictate".. More to do with "Scared of needles"... "I need 30 days"....."I get sick"..."I would be blood drained"....and the new one (Jimmy Kinnel show) "He's bigger than me so the test would affect me more than him"

Now if he had said from the begining till NOW that "Pride" i would be behind manny 100% but i cant see any other boxer getting away with something like this and i seriously cant see Mayweather getting away with a single excuse from the manny excuses list.

Most of the excuses were made by his team. The rest I look at as trying to save face. This is also reversible too. Floyd said he would beat Manny's ass after Pac stopped Cotto. Not long after that it was "only if he agrees to WADA style testing". It works both ways. The blame lays with both of them in my opinion. If they both truly want the fight they'll find some middle ground.

[JAB5239]

So when he ****s out mayweather what excuse have you got for him then????

I like Manny and I ain't no fan of Floyd, but if this fight comes off I'd bet my house on Floyd. I'll be rooting for Pac, but the smart money will be on "Money".

[Valero Is God]

That was one of the arguement i was having with a Cotto fan on here once, JMM was a better technical fighter than cotto and thats one of the reason Pac alway struggle against him, The Hattons,cottos,clotteys,Margaritos would alway make Pac look like a world-beater IMO but even Pac at this stage would struggle and look horrible with a Joan Guzman,Cory spinks or Zahir Raheem..

so do you think if ali fought a lot of frazier type of boxer, would he have a lot of loses?