Max Kellerman calls Pacquiao the greatest fighter ever! Do you agree?

[Steak]

That's your opinion. I really see it the opposite. Jofre and Wilde are Top 25 unquestionable ATG's in my opinion. Pacqiauo being around the Top 50 in my view.

I rank Jofre higher than Pacqiauo firstly for his dominance and secondly because he is the Greatest Bantamweight in boxing history IMO.

And I rank Wilde higher because he is the greatest Flyweight of all time with an insane level of longevity.

That is more than a reasonable argument for them being ranked higher. And to be honest, I think you might be the only person who I have ever spoken to who has vast boxing knowledge that ranks Pacqiauo above those 2.

level of opposition>dominance and pretty records. Jofre and Wilde didnt beat much more top competition than Pacquiao did(arguably less), and yet Pacquiao still has the better best wins and success over multiple weight classes.

but, like you said, thats just my opinion.

[UglyPug]

nah, he is the greatest southpaw of all time, though. My opinion he is. Whitaker is the second best of all time, and Hagler is the third best southpaw of all time. It is just so hard to compare guys from different era's, so this is about the most subjective argument in all of boxing, probably the most subjective sport to compare notwithstanding.

[IronDanHamza]

level of opposition>dominance and pretty records. Jofre and Wilde didnt beat much more top competition than Pacquiao did(arguably less), and yet Pacquiao still has the better best wins and success over multiple weight classes.

but, like you said, thats just my opinion.

That's your criteria. I usually use that but as Jofre and Wilde are the GOAT in their weight class IMO which both have a deep history I is a key reason behind why I and many others rank them higher than Pacqiauo. That's without Jofre's utter dominance over Top competition and Wilde's longevity.

Multiple weight classes doesn't automatically mean anything in my view, I mean, Oscar holds the 2nd highest record for that and I don't even have him in my Top 70 probably.

I mean, by that logic you would suggest Oscar is higher than those 2. Which surely you don't agree with.

I can't see how someone could rank Pacqiauo above Monzon who as you know only ventured in one weight class as opposed to Pacqiauo's many.

[Alibata]

There really is little argument Manny Pacqiuao is a Top 10 ATG. Or even Top 20.

I don't recall any legit historian having Pacqiauo in there Top 10 list or even Top 20 actually.

But feel free to provide a link if there is.

Who would you consider a legit historian? That doesn't have Manny within the top 25

[Ishy Aytan]

Who would you consider a legit historian? That doesn't have Manny within the top 25

Bert Sugar. Hes the only guy i would follow in terms of an ATG list. His knowledge of the sport is second to none.

[featherFist]

NO.....

In "my" top 10 though.

[Sugar Sting Ray]

Off the Top of my head?

Robinson -definitely greater than Pacquiao
Greb - could be greater but unfortunately, there aren't any videos
Langford - could be greater but unfortunately a victim of racism
Charles - great light heavy, okay heavy - not as great as Pacquiao
Armstrong - three lineal titles and could have won two more had there been junior and super titles in his time. Possibly greater than Pac resume-wise but Armstrong only fought one way. Didn't have the versatility of Pac. I call it even between Pac and Hammerin' Henry
Moore - great light heavyweight, perhaps the greatest light heavyweight. He was the oldest champ who also reigned 10 years as champ. His resume compared to Pac's would be like comparing apples and oranges. Their accomplishments are of a totally different nature. I call it even between the "Old Mongoose" versus PacMan
Wilde - one division champ but dominant in that division He fought over a hundred times but don't forget that many of those opponents had losing records with less than 5 pro fights and Wilde fought them multiple times. Pacquiao beats Wilde by a wild margin, accomplishment wise and versatility wise.
Monzon - one of the great middleweights. His accomplishments pale in comparison to Pac's. Pac's also stronger, more versatile, and a lot faster. Pac by a huge margin
Ali - larger than life. Even larger than Pac. Fought and dominated the best of the best (many of whom would have been dominant in other eras). Ali beats Pac in my book.
Louis - greatest puncher ever. Perfect puncher and finisher. Had problems against Rummage, Pastor, Walcott, and Conn. Pac beats the Brown Bomber.
Pep - one division champ. Like Armstrong and Wilde, his winning streaks were against fighters that had there professional debuts or had 10 fights or less and were not rated in the top 50 in the world. Greatest counterpuncher ever and would give Pac head aches. But Pac beats him by resume. Pac never fought anyone with a losing record and less than 10 fights during his championship years.
Whitaker - great counterpuncher and technician who didn't have the discipline to always stick to his gameplan, as evidenced in his fight against the woman beater crackhead Roger Mayweather. Pac kills him.
Gans - padded record but dangerous. Pac beats him easy.
B.Leonard - same thing. Too many fights against debutants and people with 10 fights or less with losing records. Master counter puncher. Would be 50/50 versus Pac prime for prime. But Pac's resume beats him.
R.Leoanrd - had very few fights but his victories were of very high quality. Like Pac, criticized for his catch weight fights, especially the one against Lelonde whose 175 title he won at 167 lbs. He won two titles that night. The other one was the newly minted super middleweight title made just for him.
Style-wise would probably beat Pac at welterweight. But pound for pound, Pacquiao, who is a faster version of Duran would beat him. Pac wins.
Gavilian - very light puncher but very fast. One division champion. Pac beats him.
Arguello - top 50 fighter. Pac owns him by resume, speed, versatility, and power. Equal to Pac when it comes to "heart".
Fitzsimmons - very underrated. Top 30 fighter. Pac wins.
Griffith - top 60 fighter
Walker - would probably out slug Pac in a pound for pound fight. But Pac has too much versatility and speed. Very close. I have both in my top 10
Jofre - top 50 fighter. No match to Pac resume and fight wise.
Napoles - would get murdered by Pac. Resume isnothing compared to Pac. Top 100 fighter.
Ketchel - potentially top 3 all time had he not died too young. Hard to compare with Pac.
Tunney - one division champ
Mclarnin - very underrated top 30 fighter. Pac beats him in resume and in the ring due to speed, footwork, and power.

Pac is easily in the top 6 with Ali, Duran, Armstrong, Pep, and Moore. But Robinson beats them all.

[Chups]

Bert Sugar. Hes the only guy i would follow in terms of an ATG list. His knowledge of the sport is second to none.

And this is 2 years ago.




Bert Sugar: He's easily in the Top 20.

[Xeraser]

Bert Sugar. Hes the only guy i would follow in terms of an ATG list. His knowledge of the sport is second to none.

Sugar said PAC is easily top 20 in his list. I wonder what are your thoughts about that since you dislike PAC.

[IronDanHamza]

Who would you consider a legit historian? That doesn't have Manny within the top 25

Most historians I go by passed away seeing very little of Pacqiauo or even none.

The likes of the IBRO I see as legit, who don't have Pacqiauo in the Top 25 of all time, I believe.

Off that top of my head I can't think of any. But like I said if you could provide a link for one feel free as I genuninely can't recall any.