My Top Ten Greatest Heavyweight Champs Of All Time!

[Sharkey]

However, Langford never won a legit world title. That is a fact.

No, that's not fact, that's opinion.

Judging by the proclamation of him being "world heavyweight champion" (not "coloured") by such organizations as the National Sporting Club (then the oldest boxing org in boxing) and early members of the International Boxing Union, obviously some people thought Langford's claim was more legitimate than Johnson's, who could have avoided all the confusion by simply showing up for that scheduled fight in late May of 1909 against Langford instead of pulling the no-show that he did.

To me, if a champion signs to defend against the leading contender like Johnson did with Langford, and then proceeds to not bother showing up (nor giving any advanced reason for not showing), he then forfeits any claim he has to the title. God knows and so do you, that if Johnson had trying pulling that **** in today's age he'd have been stripped of his title just as quick as you could say his name, as well as being branded a "chicken ****".

[Boxalot]

If you type Sam Langfords name into google it comes up with countless links that will tell you he was the first man to be inducted into the hall of fame without winning a World Title.

It isn't an opinion if someone is a title holder. I thought that Peter was better than Valeuv when Valeuv had a belt, but it didn't make Peter a champion, did it? I see what you are saying, and i agree, Johnson should have been stripped for not fighting Langford, but the fact remains he wasn't and Sam Langford never did win a legit World title.

If the coloured belt was a legit world title then Harry Wills has more title defences than Joe Louis, and the record books say that Joe Louis has the most title defences. The record books will also say that as good as he was, and whether it's right or wrong, Sam Langford never won a world title.

[Nostromo]

1. Louis
2. Ali
3. Tyson
4. Johnson
5. Marciano
6. Dempsey
7. Holmes
8. Liston
9. Foreman
10. Frazier

[Sharkey]

It isn't an opinion if someone is a title holder.

No it isn't, but for someone to speak on the legitimacy of said title would be based entirely on one's own opinion. In the case of Langford it is a FACT that he was considered a world title holder, and that's something you or I cannot dispute because it's already been written in history.

"When Sam Langford, the Boston negro, knocked out Ian Hague, the British hevyweight champion, out in the fourth at the National Sporting Club in London Mondy night, he was promptly hailed as the new world heavyweight champion by the English, who said that Johnson, by crawling out of the Langford match scheduled for that day, had forfeited all right to the title." - May 26th, 1909, Washington Post

"Sam Langford, hailed by the National Sporting Club, as the champion heavyweight of the world." - May 27th, 1909, Washington Post

"Sam Langford has recieved a championship belt from the National Sporting Club after the Club hailed Langford as the champion heavy weight of the world." AP report dated June 2nd, 1909

"National Sporting Club proclaiming Sam Langford heavyweight champion of England and the World." - Nebraska State Journal, July 4th, 1909

Just a few of many sources where it clearly states Langford was considered "heavyweight champion of the world", so unless you can come up with something stating that the National Sporting Club DIDN'T consider Langford as such, then you're claim that he wasn't considered the "world" title holder would be factually incorrect.

Out of curiousity though, at that period in time (mid 1909 or before), what made Johnson's disputed claim the legitimate one to you?

[Boxalot]

ESPN - Boxing historian Bert Sugar is marginally less effusive; in his book, "Boxing's 100 Greatest Fighters," Sugar ranks Langford No. 16. But, he wrote, "he is the highest non-champion." For all his accomplishments, Langford was never granted a world title shot at any of the weights in which he fought, because he was both a very good fighter, and a black one.

Coxscorner - Sam Langford, known as the “Boston Terror” and "The Boston Tar Baby," is considerd to be the greatest fighter to never win a world boxing championship. The reason is simple. He was the most avoided fighter in the illustrious history of boxing.

And, indeed from this very site: //krikya360.com/forums/sh...d.php?t=125546

[Sharkey]

ESPN - Boxing historian Bert Sugar is marginally less effusive; in his book, "Boxing's 100 Greatest Fighters," Sugar ranks Langford No. 16. But, he wrote, "he is the highest non-champion." For all his accomplishments, Langford was never granted a world title shot at any of the weights in which he fought, because he was both a very good fighter, and a black one.

Coxscorner - Sam Langford, known as the “Boston Terror” and "The Boston Tar Baby," is considerd to be the greatest fighter to never win a world boxing championship. The reason is simple. He was the most avoided fighter in the illustrious history of boxing.

And, indeed from this very site: //krikya360.com/forums/sh...d.php?t=125546

LOL.

Yeah, I've read all that before and many a times, thanks, but again, if I want to read about what was happening in 1909, I'm going to be looking for sources that were written in 1909, not one from a modern writer that was written nearly 100 after the fact.

Sugar's a clown anyways, doesn't do much in the way of "digging deep" as far as his own research goes, and who still spouts a bunch of myths (like the one with Pep winning a round by not throwing a punch) that have been proven inaccurate by those who do "dig deep" into boxing's history, like Monte, who either doesn't accept the NSC's claim based on his opinion on legitimacy or was simply unaware of it.

[Sharkey]

Out of curiousity though, at that period in time (mid 1909 or before), what made Johnson's disputed claim the legitimate one to you?

Still curious about this question, Boxalot.

[marciano207]

1.Muhammad Ali
2.Jack Dempsey
3.Joe Louis
4.George Foreman
5.Joe Fraizer
6.Mike Tyson
7.Rocky Marciano
8.Larry Holmes
9.Sonny Liston
10.Evander Holyfield or Jack Johnson i couldent decide

[futurebeast67]

i would move up dempsey and maybe move marciano up one

[The Iron Man]

10.Lennox Lewis : Defeated every man he went in the ring with, which is not something many boxers can say. Greatest ever british boxer extremely smart in the ring and very powerful.


9.Jack Johnson: The first "Real heavyweight" and extremley talented boxer, he would take opponents all the way just to punish them. If he fought in a more modern era he may have been higher in the list, but he fought many middle weights and light heavyweights.

8.Jack Dempsey: Was one of the most Dominant fighters, amazingly powerful and could knock you out with either Hand!!

7.Larry Holmes: Had probably the best left jab ever in the Heavyweight division.Living in the Shadow of Ali, it was very hard for holmes to make as much of an impact but he did this with an 8 year run as heavyweight champ

6.Joe Frazier: The First person to ever beat ali, fought in the "golden era" of boxing and was one of the best! had one of the best left hooks in boxing history. He had a iron chin, and was part of some of the best ever fights.

5.George Foreman: He not only has one hell of a grill, he had one hell of a punch that knocked down frazier 6 times in one round!! He retired and came back to boxing to become the oldest heavyweight champion of all time at the age of 45 which was 20 years after he lost it to Ali

4.Mike Tyson: The Youngest ever Heavy weight Champion, and the 1st to unify 3 major belts and become the undisputed champion. If Tyson had kept Rooney, he would most probably be #1. The most dominant boxer ever in there prime. He had incredible speed and power, a combination of the two that never been seen and probably never will be. He had the greatest ever left hook. His Opponent feared him so much that they would concentrate on not getting hit rather than winning, its a shame he didn’t keep on the right track.. but nether the less he is still 4th.

3.Rocky Marciano: 49-0, the only heavyweight champion in this list never to lost a fight. His power and stamina were incredible the same goes for his chin. And it looks like his record will never be defeated


2.Muhammad Ali: "The Greatest" well almost, easily the quickest heavyweight of all time, and fought in many of the Greatest ever fights. He dominated at a time with many other great boxers, two others who are in the list. Regaining the Title twice he was an awesome athlete

1.Joe Louis: 25 title defences a record that has never been broken! He was technically gifted as well as having a devastating punch that got him the #1 place in ESPNs Greatest Punchers. Lethal with both arms, this man earns his place in my List!