Comments Thread For: Barry Hearn: Wilder is Not Very Good, Easiest Fight For Joshua

[Granath]

None of them people are Deontay Wilder, Wilder isnt new on the scene hes had 41 fights. There is no point telling us what money can be made in America by Boxers when Deontay Wilder isnt one of them Boxers.

However somebody who is making that kind of money is Anthony Joshua and thats without breaking America yet. He likely wont as Americans dont often take to foreigners but he doesnt need it, if he did do well in the States then great but with or without hes by far the biggest draw in the sport, and that not opinion that is a fact.

As for that 15 million offer to Wilder, if it was so bad, chump change, crack money chicken feed how come his super massive PPV Fury fight could only earn him about half of that and be hailed as a success?

Doesn't matter. You can try to explain it away but there's no way Wilder takes a fight where he's 20% of the purse and has no upside. It's absurd and it's an insult to anyone's intelligence to believe that's a fair deal.

Don't pee on my leg and tell me it's raining.

[DaNeutral.]

Doesn't matter. You can try to explain it away but there's no way Wilder takes a fight where he's 20% of the purse and has no upside. It's absurd and it's an insult to anyone's intelligence to believe that's a fair deal.

Don't pee on my leg and tell me it's raining.

Im not, im peeing on your leg and telling you im peeing on your leg. When they offered 15 million Wilders biggest revenue was 2.1 million v Ortiz. All these American been pointing out Joshua aint no draw in America, Wilder v Fury proved Wilder aint no draw in America, They called Wilder v Fury a mega fight and it clearly wasnt so why is everybody quoting top dollar when Wilder clearly isnt making that.

So If the 15 million was 20% You saying Joshua was going to receive 60 million from it?

[ChrisCook]

My last paragraph was simply to make it clear that now, after all the fallout since Fall 2018, to say "yeah, we'll now take your initial ask" isn't going to work.

Wilder-Fury generated at least $25m on USPPV, plus another $3.5m+ in ticket sales at the live gate, plus who knows how much on the fight in the UK, and the other revenues, with the actual fight being a really good one that captured so much attention that the rematch is likely to do double the business.

DAZN isn't going to bid on anything, because the fight isn't going to even end up going to bid; both camps jointly asking for the deadline to be moved back makes it pretty clear that the deal is almost done.

Wilder and Fury will have their fight, and count their money together (if Fury wins, the third fight is allegedly heading to Old Trafford in Manchester), and then whomever stands at the end of that will sit down with Hearn/Joshua, and will negotiate a full-on deal, rather than simply taking a fee and be dictated to.

Interesting take on it but and as I said in my last post, I don't think we really know what's going on, just what is reported; so we can probably take it all with a pinch of salt... time will tell.

[Granath]

Im not, im peeing on your leg and telling you im peeing on your leg. When they offered 15 million Wilders biggest revenue was 2.1 million v Ortiz. All these American been pointing out Joshua aint no draw in America, Wilder v Fury proved Wilder aint no draw in America, They called Wilder v Fury a mega fight and it clearly wasnt so why is everybody quoting top dollar when Wilder clearly isnt making that.

So If the 15 million was 20% You saying Joshua was going to receive 60 million from it?

Quite possibly. That fight does over a million PPV buys. People love watching undefeated HW champs fight each other and that's the fight people want. Casual American fight fans also like guys who are pretty and lets face it both Joshua and Wilder looked like they were carved from marble. Both look like Adonises. Wilder/Joshua for all the marbles the fight that sells 1m PPV easy, could be more. So I could see that purse hitting $100m and with no upside Joshua gets the vast bulk of the money.

It's a horrible deal for Wilder. Want a decent one? 50/40 Joshua/Wilder split with the last 10% going to the victor. If you think Joshua is by far the bigger draw and better man then 55/35 with that same 10% going to the winner. If he truly is the better man he walks away with 2/3rds the cash and the belts. That's how this deal gets done, not some lowball offer that's insulting.

[DaNeutral.]

Quite possibly. That fight does over a million PPV buys. People love watching undefeated HW champs fight each other and that's the fight people want. Casual American fight fans also like guys who are pretty and lets face it both Joshua and Wilder looked like they were carved from marble. Both look like Adonises. Wilder/Joshua for all the marbles the fight that sells 1m PPV easy, could be more. So I could see that purse hitting $100m and with no upside Joshua gets the vast bulk of the money.

It's a horrible deal for Wilder. Want a decent one? 50/40 Joshua/Wilder split with the last 10% going to the victor. If you think Joshua is by far the bigger draw and better man then 55/35 with that same 10% going to the winner. If he truly is the better man he walks away with 2/3rds the cash and the belts. That's how this deal gets done, not some lowball offer that's insulting.

Well Wilder has just been in a fight with an undefeated champion, the Wilder fans certainly liked to point out Fury was the Lineal champion. That sold 13 thousand tickets and netted Wilder about 5 million. Swap Fury for Joshua and it is a hundred million dollar fight, you guess. That just sounds like Joshua is a massive clear A side to me in which case 60-40 is more than fair.

But like all Wilder fans rather than look at the poor numbers he has been doing his whole 41 fight career to date you want to ignore all that and guess that in the future Wilder is some mega star. Where as Joshua been doing mega star numbers for years but again you want to ignore all that and on this one occasion it is not down to him its down to Wilder, or both of them.

Id say the profile of that fight rises based on it being Wilder v Joshua but any raised profile of Wilder is not going to equate to 50% or even close to it so 40 is a great offer for Deontay. Anthony Joshua will still be the massive A side over Deontay so such a close split is charity to Wilder cuz he aint bringing it.

If Wilder was going to turn into a superstar it would of happened already, mainly in his last fight, and that was the point of the last fight, to prove Wilder stands at the same financial level as Joshua and it turned out as a big fail on that front, great fight, i loved it, but as a stunt to prove Wilders worth is level with Joshuas it failed miserably.

Hell dont forget Joshua offered Wilder chicken feed crack money and was turned down, but that offer was for more than Deontay got for the fight that was meant to prove he is a joint A side and deserves 50-50.

60-40 is fair. I know you Americans dont like it but on this occasion, which is damn rare, a Brit is the sports big money maker. I just dont think Americans can digest that because they just think America is the centre of the universe.

Not that it matters Deontay dont want it, hes run for nearly 2 years now, run and hid just like he did with Wlad.

[Granath]

But like all Wilder fans rather than look at the poor numbers he has been doing his whole 41 fight career to date you want to ignore all that and guess that in the future Wilder is some mega star. Where as Joshua been doing mega star numbers for years but again you want to ignore all that and on this one occasion it is not down to him its down to Wilder, or both of them.

Id say the profile of that fight rises based on it being Wilder v Joshua but any raised profile of Wilder is not going to equate to 50% or even close to it so 40 is a great offer for Deontay. Anthony Joshua will still be the massive A side over Deontay so such a close split is charity to Wilder cuz he aint bringing it.

If Wilder was going to turn into a superstar it would of happened already, mainly in his last fight, and that was the point of the last fight, to prove Wilder stands at the same financial level as Joshua and it turned out as a big fail on that front, great fight, i loved it, but as a stunt to prove Wilders worth is level with Joshuas it failed miserably.

Hell dont forget Joshua offered Wilder chicken feed crack money and was turned down, but that offer was for more than Deontay got for the fight that was meant to prove he is a joint A side and deserves 50-50.

60-40 is fair. I know you Americans dont like it but on this occasion, which is damn rare, a Brit is the sports big money maker. I just dont think Americans can digest that because they just think America is the centre of the universe.

Hold on. We agree. 60-40 is probably fair or close to it. Cool! Excellent.

WHEN Joshua offers a 60/40 split and IF Wilder turns it down then I'll agree that Wilder is ducking Joshua. But that offer hasn't been made. It hasn't come close to being made. And since we agree that 60-40 is in the right ballpark then it follows we can agree $15m flat is a ******, insulting offer that does nothing to further the discussion and has no basis being used to try to prove Wilder is ducking Joshua. Which was my whole point in the first place.

What doesn't follow is your conclusion that Wilder has been running from Joshua since such an offer hasn't been made by Joshua's camp. Their offers have all been of the ****** variety. So who is ducking who?

[DaNeutral.]

Hold on. We agree. 60-40 is probably fair or close to it. Cool! Excellent.

WHEN Joshua offers a 60/40 split and IF Wilder turns it down then I'll agree that Wilder is ducking Joshua. But that offer hasn't been made. It hasn't come close to being made. And since we agree that 60-40 is in the right ballpark then it follows we can agree $15m flat is a ******, insulting offer that does nothing to further the discussion and has no basis being used to try to prove Wilder is ducking Joshua. Which was my whole point in the first place.

What doesn't follow is your conclusion that Wilder has been running from Joshua since such an offer hasn't been made by Joshua's camp. Their offers have all been of the ****** variety. So who is ducking who?

I actually think it is more of a generous offer than a fair one, its a little beyond fair. And ive never thought the 15 million was a wonderful offer but it was a legitimate and decent offer at the time. 15million to Wilder, what did you think Joshua was going to get? It was going to be more but it wasnt going to be a massive amount more, it roughy worked out at a 70-30 split of expected revenue which at the time didnt seem so bad.

But Hearn said they are offering 60-40 right now, thats where we are at, he cant go backwards from there. Deontays stock has risen but there is still a big gulf between them financially, i certainly dont see any argument for 50-50 thats for sure which ever way i try to look at it.

As for Wilder running. Just my opinion. I only see 1 of them threatening to freeze out people who want his belt. I only see 1 of them talking about not caring about Joshua or the belts. He could of fought Wlad, he could of fought Povetkin and in a few years we will be saying he could of fought Joshua, his resume stinks of protection, his managers words over the years stink of protection. Weve seen ducks in this sport before which panned out very much how Wilder Joshua is panning out.

[mathed]

If Wilder thought he had any chance whatsoever to beat AJ, he would have fought him already. If he ever man’s up, he’ll be destroyed in under 6 rds.

[Granath]

pected revenue which at the time didnt seem so bad.

But Hearn said they are offering 60-40 right now, thats where we are at, he cant go backwards from there. Deontays stock has risen but there is still a big gulf between them financially, i certainly dont see any argument for 50-50 thats for sure which ever way i try to look at it.

It's a bit more complicated than that.

Supposedly (more on that later) Hearn offered 60-40 but with a poison pill. There's a rematch clause in the contract that limits Wilder to 30% if he loses the first match but only 50% if we wins. That's unacceptable. If AJ gets knocked out then in any rematch Wilder has to get more than half the gate since he'd be holding all the titles. That's if we believe Hearn at all on that point and face it his credibility is a bit dubious.

We know he offered a 65-35 split with a $15 million guarantee in mid-Jan. Again, that sucks and I actually doubt that just a couple of days later he upped it to 60-40. But even if he did he purposely sabotaged his own deal with that poison pill on the rematch.

If Hearn wants a deal he has to stop poisoning the well and playing gotcha games. I don't know if Wilder would take a 40-60 split on the first match. I think he should but I could see him hold out for 45-55 but there's a deal to be made there. However, if Wilder wins - and I'm on record as saying I believe AJ has the better chance of winning - they can't dictate a 50/50. At that point AJ has to take whatever Wilder took in the first fight.

[juggernaut666]

That was a ****** offer and only fools would think that constitutes ducking.

Floyd Mayweather made $275M in the fight against McGregor. McG made $85M. Pac made $160M against Mayweather (who made over $200M). That's the upper end of the market but it shows how much money there is to be made from a highly anticipated fight.

$15M for a fight with two undefeated HW Champs is chump change. While Joshua/Wilder wouldn't be the purse of Mayweather/Pac, that fight would have brought (and probably still would) at least 1 million PPV buys. Why would Wilder take $15M when Joshua in that deal would walk away with $50M - $75M or more?

It was and remains a lowball offer and only idiots think it was legitimate and use it as an excuse for ducking.

The offer was so ****** that wilder accepted it ? And was a 7/8 times his pay ? If it was a ****** offer why did finkel deem it o.k to accept and only decline it based ion a no date and venue but then do a no date venue with Fury who they sat down with ? Isnt meeting counter productive in Finkels opinion ? Is nt that the real reason why the Wilder fight never got done in the end of April 2018,because of TWO cancelled meetings deemed a waste of time ? lol