Where do you rank Manny Pacquiao on the GOAT list???

[iLovesoccermoms]

realistically top 50, perhaps even 40

[Brother Jay]

******s really think he is the greatest fighter of all time

dude got floored by jabs, KO'd by 112 lbs cab drivers, and lost to the same guy 3 times. He also has a huge cloud of su****ion around him and most Americans view him as just another juiced cheater. If he retired right now I would have him somewhere #25-#40, although because he is a cheater he might not deserve a spot at all.

^^^ hello!

The guy is exciting and comes to ****.

He's not a top 50 fighter though. His catchweight bouts were his legacy building bouts, and in the context in which we're speaking, they have no real legacy value.

His first 50 fights were against bums in southeast Asia.

JMM has taken all of the steam out of him being a top fighter.

All of his fights after Diaz were against men who were once upon a time champions, but NEVER when Manny chose to face them. Cotto won a vacant belt to lose to Manny.

His claim as an 8 division titlist is weak because he used several vacant belts to make a case for that.

So basically, his wins over Barrera and Morales are what are carrying his legacy.

Rate that.

Not Top 50. And when looking at what DeadLikeMe wrote, maybe not Top 100.

I believe that a USADA OST would really put all of that in perspective. But we all know that isn't going to happen. Not even against Bradley.

[KnockUTheFukOut]

if your 16 and young and/or your Filipino then to you he is Top 3 All Time

If your 25 and older and you are a TRUE BOXING FAN and love, know and respect the History of the Sport then you know that he would be lucky to Crack Top 50 on a All Time List

Sorry but this ERA is not good enough for me to rate Pacquiao and even Mayweather, sorry but the highest Rated All Time Fighter that is still active today is Bernard Hopkins!

His Resume>Mayweather and Pacquiao...EASILY!

[Brother Jay]

if your 16 and young and/or your Filipino then to you he is Top 3 All Time

If your 25 and older and you are a TRUE BOXING FAN and love, know and respect the History of the Sport then you know that he would be lucky to Crack Top 50 on a All Time List

Sorry but this ERA is not good enough for me to rate Pacquiao and even Mayweather, sorry but the highest Rated All Time Fighter that is still active today is Bernard Hopkins!

His Resume>Mayweather and Pacquiao...EASILY!

The following responds to the notion that Hopkins should be very highly rated. It uses Ward as the subject for the comparison:

I don't think Ward has had a better career than Hopkins yet. However its important to remember that Hopkins career wasn't ATG until he fought Taylor.

Bernard Hopkins hadn't fought a champion from 1988-2001. That's a hell of a long time to avoid champions. I don't care how many guys BHOP defended his IBF portion of the MW championship against.

In my book, Monzon still holds the record for title defenses because Hopkins was defending only one part of the MW championship. Monzon was the undisputed champion. Hopkins most certainly was not.

Hopkins career wasn't really that impressive until 2001 when he fought WW Trinidad and later on WW DLH in 2004. He got some praise, but come on .. he was waiting for little guys to move up. No real challenge there.

Its was in 2005 that Hopkins FINALLY stepped up. Even in defeat, Hopkins did more in his two fights against Taylor than he did in all of those other years as the IBF champion. He actually fought a young, hungry talented fighter. The last time he had done that was against a young Roy Jones.

Then, his career soared when he defeated Antonio Tarver, Not many gave an aged Hopkins much of a chance up at ltHW, but he pulled it out and looked great doing it.

It was at that point that Hopkins began looking like a ATG. He was already a HOF'er because of his title defenses, but he hadn't really beaten anyone legacy worthy except 2 WWs UNTIL he beat Tarver.

After that point, he's only lost once. He's got upset wins over Pavlik and Pascal. RJJ was a shadow of his former glory at the point they rematched.

Still, Hopkins really turned it up in his twilight. I give credit where it's due. I've never been particularly fond of Hopkins as a fighter, but its hard to deny that he finally began conducting his career like a true champion towards the end.

Ward is off to an excellent start. He's got a ways to go before anyone begins talk of him outdoing BHOP career-wise, but if he continues to fight the #1 and #2 in his division, defends his titles, unifies and moves up to ltHW for a showdown with Dawson, he could conceivably outdo BHOP by 2015.

The only reason this is possible is because BHOP squandered a lot of important legacy-building years from 1988-2001. To not have fought any champions within that window really hurt BHOP's legacy.

We have to call it like it is.

I don't think Hopkins should be rated as highly as boxers who have spent their entire careers fighting the #1 and #2 fighters in the divisions. In fact I know so. I think BHOP has dramatically moved up starting in 2005, but he's been a pro since 1988. He's doing now what he should have been doing since the late 80's, early 90's.

People are giving him credit because its amazing for him to be doing it at such an advanced age. That, however, does not compensate in any way for the lackluster career he had before 2001.

So I disagree.

[DeadLikeMe]

The following responds to the notion that Hopkins should be very highly rated. It uses Ward as the subject for the comparison:



I don't think Hopkins should be rated as highly as boxers who have spent their entire careers fighting the #1 and #2 fighters in the divisions. In fact I know so. I think BHOP has dramatically moved up starting in 2005, but he's been a pro since 1988. He's doing now what he should have been doing since the late 80's, early 90's.

People are giving him credit because its amazing for him to be doing it at such an advanced age. That, however, does not compensate in any way for the lackluster career he had before 2001.

So I disagree.

Wasn't BHop promoting himself back then (at least around 2000/2001) and he got blackballed by the promotional companies so he couldn't get really any of the good fights. They used to say "hes too boring" "he doesn't draw a crowd" and plenty of other excuses to not try to fight him. BHop is so damn tricky and dirty he is a tough out for anyone in history. That being said though, yeah his and RJJ's resumes both could have been a bit better.

[Roy Hobbs]

I have pacquiao top 20. what he has done in terms of scaling divisions from turning pro as a 16 year old at 106 lbs to being a successful welterweight along with his legendary wars vs the 3 mexican first ballot hall of famers along with his already thick boxing decorations from being multiple fighter of the year winner, knock out of the year, fightger of the decade, winner the longevity of his top 10 p4p reign and as 1#, his overall impact in the sport as the new star to carry the sport along with floyd after oscar, you add all of that you have a true full fledged ATG I personally have in the top 20. If he fights floyd and beats floyd I have no trouble putting pacquiao in my top 10.

I think every time period produces enough great boxers that have both the talent and resume that you need to include one from every time period to grace the upper echelons of all time great rankings. I cant take any ATG list that have nothing but pre 1960s era fighters in almost every top 20-30 slot. I think that is a uneven and dishonest take at a legitimate ATG list. Every era deserves a candidate that is worthy with both talent and resume to challenge for inclusion in the very top of ATG rankings. I think Pacquiao merits it.

[KnockUTheFukOut]

The following responds to the notion that Hopkins should be very highly rated. It uses Ward as the subject for the comparison:



I don't think Hopkins should be rated as highly as boxers who have spent their entire careers fighting the #1 and #2 fighters in the divisions. In fact I know so. I think BHOP has dramatically moved up starting in 2005, but he's been a pro since 1988. He's doing now what he should have been doing since the late 80's, early 90's.

People are giving him credit because its amazing for him to be doing it at such an advanced age. That, however, does not compensate in any way for the lackluster career he had before 2001.

So I disagree.

OK? That is YOUR OPINION and I respect it even though I don't fully agree with it!

But that is what All Time Rankings Are...OPINIONS! Their is no such thing as a "OFFICIAL ATG LIST" all of those List are just Opinions...some ATG List have Ali #1 others have Robinson or Armstrong #1

IMO Hopkins is the Highest Rated ATG fighters that is still active! No matter if it took him up until the last few years to finally get the respect and the attention of many...

[Alx.]

11-20 ish for sure

[CHOWWOKKA]

typical fl0mo***ual thread. worthless.

LOL Because corners didn't put Manny at #1 the thread is worthless .

[Brother Jay]

OK? That is YOUR OPINION and I respect it even though I don't fully agree with it!

But that is what All Time Rankings Are...OPINIONS! Their is no such thing as a "OFFICIAL ATG LIST" all of those List are just Opinions...some ATG List have Ali #1 others have Robinson or Armstrong #1

IMO Hopkins is the Highest Rated ATG fighters that is still active! No matter if it took him up until the last few years to finally get the respect and the attention of many...

Okay .. and that's your opinion. I respect your right to it.

The evidence, however, doesn't support your argument though.

Wins over Tarver, Wright, Pavlik and Pascal did not make BHOP the highest rated ATG of this era. No way. He still lost Taylor twice, his win over Wright arguably should have gone the other way, he lost to Calzaghe and he got a draw against Pascal.

Its not like BHOP is on any streak. I give credit where its due but not fighting even one champion from 1988-2000 hurts his chances as an ATG. Four fights isn't going to change that.

We can agree to disagree, but let's not pretend that the facts are on your side.