Interesting article on Sonny Liston

[OctoberRed]

What did you guys think of the recent Showtime documentary on Liston?

Very good. We need one on Anorak.

[jaded]

What did you guys think of the recent Showtime documentary on Liston?

Thought it was pretty good.

[Anthony342]

Thought it was pretty good.

Me too. I might get it on DVD if it's released on that format. Until then, I have it saved on my DVR.

[QueensburyRules]

- -Don't think there has been much if anything new uncovered about Sonny.

I have no patience for most docs. I might scan thru a new book, but unless his FBI files are opened, that would be about the last thing.

The census records were supposed to tell us his age, but all they did was add to that murkiness.

Be interesting if Cus had been around for Sonny at puberty as he was for Tyson. He'd be even more monstrous in the ring than his reputation in the day.

[Rusty Tromboni]

Most people don't realize he was actually smaller than Ali. For all of the hype of him being labeled a bully, he was smaller than Ali, Cleveland Williams and several of his other opponents. When I was at the IBHOF I saw the bust they have of his fist, it looks like a small turkey! Would not want to get hit by Sonny. I still believe his fights against Ali were both fixes. Liston is highly underrated and is in my top 5 HWs list.

Great insight.

Liston was also waaaay faster at that age than Ali would be.



I always thought of him as the Second Coming of Sam Liston that didn't happen.

He wasted his youth and only started his career at the age when Sam's career was coming to a close.

Can you imagine him fighting guys like Willard, Carnera, Schmeling, Cooney, Bunger -- all bigger, better men than the men who beat Sam. He'd look like a modern era Langford.

Defensively, Sam was more of a natural, a lot like Hopkins who learned as he went and became a true master. But Liston was a muuuch more technically sound and polished Boxer.

[billeau2]

what a finisher

i agree with Dempey that Liston was underrated. What a finisher and combo puncher. Liston had incredible economy of movement as well, and we have not even got to that jab yet!

[ecto55]

- -Doubt Sonny 15" fists have been exceeded and he's in top 10% for reach. At 210-220, he was a load for his era.

I'm not sure his 84" reach will ever be matched under say 6'2"... and the strength and musculature in that frame - raw boned strength.

I'd love to see more docs or books on Patterson. And I think Chuvalo would be a great subject for a biopic (in his autobiography, he claims himself as partial inspiration for Stallone's Rocky).

Liston would make for a cool biopic as well, but I feel like his life was so murky, no one wants to claim to have "the" definitive line on him.

Yep, Chuck Wepner's another one whose life is probably too real for any movie.

Liston is a perfect example of Billy's large man theories, one of the better theories presented on the forum in a while.. He was a giant in every way but height. No one had bigger hands, longer arms, more massive muscles or bones of a larger cross section than Sonny. He was a giant in disguise. His disguise consisted of his normal height.

Exactly. There's a good picture floating around recently of an awkward encounter between Rocky Marciano and Sonny Liston, and it's surprising how little difference in height there is between the two.

[a.rihn]

Yep, Chuck Wepner's another one whose life is probably too real for any movie.

They've been trying, though. Two different movies came out, in 2017 or 2018. One had Liev Schrieber and was just OK. The other was just unwatchable.

[Anthony342]

After watching the Pariah documentary on Sonny Liston and hearing about his mob ties, it made me realize that it's not just the sleazy promoters with all the multiple belts we have now, but that boxing was pretty much always full of corruption and never had an even playing field. Even when there was just one title belt. At least Floyd Patterson was man enough to finally give Liston a title shot, even though his trainer Cus D'Amato didn't want to. Now with multiple belts and boxers with more negotiating power, you have too many fighters not willing to fight the best when it only seemed to sometimes happen back then. So it seem like there was always something crappy about the sport in any era. Racism, the mob, too many belts, the best not fighting each other. Quite unfortunate about the sport we all love.

[johnbook]

I'd love to see more docs or books on Patterson. And I think Chuvalo would be a great subject for a biopic (in his autobiography, he claims himself as partial inspiration for Stallone's Rocky).

Liston would make for a cool biopic as well, but I feel like his life was so murky, no one wants to claim to have "the" definitive line on him.

The ballad of George Chuvalo: