Dempsey Overrated?

[Humean]

He was a major cultural figure in his day and even continued to be so for many years after. The benefits of being a heavyweight world champion that people are interested in is that you get overrated.

[Suckmedry]

One thing you gotta remember about Dempsey was he was a product of a very different era.
He rode trains across America with hobos as a teen, lived on the streets, probably had his first few fights just for food and money to stay somewhere the night. The kind of intensity that breeds can't be underestimated. If Dempsey could somehow fight today, he sure as hell wouldn't be turning up just for a pay check, he would be trying to fcking kill the other guy.

[StarshipTrooper]

FIRST OF ALL - I AM NOT SAYING HE IS OVERRATED.

Ok now that that's out of the way...

I just have a simple question. How come, with only 5 title defenses over s pan of 7 years, and never regaining a title after losing it, or avenging a loss, is Dempsey always, ALWAYS ranked as like a top 5 HW of all time and even top 10 or 20 p4p all time? What makes him better than guys like Holmes, Tyson, Patterson, Liston, Foreman, Frazier, Holyfield, Walcott, etc. Some lists have these guys behind or ahead of Dempsey but in my opinion, most of them should be ahead of him. I obviously wasn't around when he was fighting, I've only seen the films that the rest of us have seen. He got whooped by Gene Tunney twice, who wasn't a great fighter (or was he? I don't see how..) The only reason people even know who Tunney is is because he beat JD.

Anyway I won't go on a long rant, which I tend to do, as you'll notice as I beging to post more here so i'll leave you with that. Appreciate all opinions, all respect to everyone. Not trying to offend anyone or piss anyone off, I know people are sensitive about the fighters they love, ESPECIALLY Jack Dempsey, I heard about what an icon he was. Well thank you in advance for any replies, Please don't hate me for asking this question.

I am not saying he is overrated, I am simply saying, can we discuss whether he may be?

Tunney wasn't a great fighter? Seriously????? Tunney is considered an ATG Light-Heavy and some even go so far as to consider him the GOAT Light-Heavy. The vast majority of reputable lists have him top-five at very least.

[Sugar Adam Ali]

I think he is historically...

Yes during his era, he was king of the hill, but when matched up with other greats, he falls woefully short. IMO

[zdiddy]

I think it will interesting to see where his stature lies in another 20 or 30 years. As more and more promoters of the older eras disappear, history may appear to correct itself and overcome it's biases of those times. We see the same in all other facets of history.

[ShoulderRoll]

His resume isn't the greatest. But those that saw him and knew the sport felt that he had no equal as a fighting man.

Ray Arcel said that he should be the only heavyweight anybody ever thinks of when they think about the greatest heavyweight champion. Gene Tunney said in the '50s that Dempsey could flatten all the current heavyweights in one night. Those words carry a lot of weight.

[Layzie Kidd]

I actually think hes underrated in todays world.

The old films are hard to watch, but when you get used to them you start knowing what to look for, which isnt as easy the first time around. He's really skilled, above average certaintly.

He's had some iffy fights, but we have to remember there were certain times he would fight withou eating and things like that. Out of his recorded fights, which arent many, he has a very big number of put downs from body shots alone. And he throws so many short hard punches its hard to pick up which one did it. And he throws them in variety.

His footwork and balance is always on point and fast. He bobs, weaves, blocks, boxes, and does every right. He can take a shot, he has speed, stamina, a very good balance overall.

[Felix25]

His resume isn't the greatest. But those that saw him and knew the sport felt that he had no equal as a fighting man.

Ray Arcel said that he should be the only heavyweight anybody ever thinks of when they think about the greatest heavyweight champion. Gene Tunney said in the '50s that Dempsey could flatten all the current heavyweights in one night. Those words carry a lot of weight.

How do you figure that? Wouldnt we be surprised if Tunney, back in the 50s, had said: "Sure, Dempsey was great for his time... but boxing has evolved since then and he would have little chance against todays more skillful fighters"? Of course he would never say something like that... because that wouldnt accentuate his own greatness. So I dont see how him praising Dempsey can be something we should read too much into.

[Weltschmerz]

BoxRec have him listed 34 as an all time heavy. That is absurd. As a fighter, I seldom hear people overrate him. I guess Tunney would be the measuring stick when we talk about how good Dempsey really was.

[Weltschmerz]