Sugar Ray Robinson and the word "entourage."

[Willie Pep 229]

Yet another example of the impact of prize fighting on the American lexicon.

Story goes . . . When SRR did his European championship tour, mostly in France, 1950, a French maitre de announced Sugar Ray to a dinner party as "Mr. Sugar Ray Robinson and his entourage."

Sugar Ray loved the way it sounded and upon his return to the States fed the term to the American sport writers who in turn made it part of the American English lexicon.

Before SRR and his "entourage" most groups that followed a prize fighter about, were referred to by the press as the fighter's "retinue."

l wonder if this is true. I do know that if you ask ChatGPT it will credit SRR for introducing the term to America. But the maitre de part of the story I heard years ago and can't confirm.

[QueensburyRules]

- - Don't know why you feed AI through chat, but I'd rather rely on your memory which is likely correct as I remember the Tour, and it was indeed impressive as it was softening, the reason he lost to the big young fit kid Randy Turpin.

Training on French champagne and cuisine would do anyone in ultimately.

[Kid Cauliflower]

I can tell you it was not in Webster's 1828 edition of American Dictionary of the English Language.

[Kid Cauliflower]

All it takes is a1940-ish dictionary. If the word is not there, Robinson's chances of single handed installation shoot way up. Brits probably incorporated it first, being only 13 miles from France. Check Oxford dictionary for appropriate period to see what the English have to say.

[Bronson66]

- - Don't know why you feed AI through chat, but I'd rather rely on your memory which is likely correct as I remember the Tour, and it was indeed impressive as it was softening, the reason he lost to the big young fit kid Randy Turpin.

Training on French champagne and cuisine would do anyone in ultimately.

Going into the 1stTurpin fight Robinson had fought 6 times in the previous 6 weeks, how out of shape can he have been?

[Bronson66]

Yet another example of the impact of prize fighting on the American lexicon.

Story goes . . . When SRR did his European championship tour, mostly in France, 1950, a French maitre de announced Sugar Ray to a dinner party as "Mr. Sugar Ray Robinson and his entourage."

Sugar Ray loved the way it sounded and upon his return to the States fed the term to the American sport writers who in turn made it part of the American English lexicon.

Before SRR and his "entourage" most groups that followed a prize fighter about, were referred to by the press as the fighter's "retinue."

l wonder if this is true. I do know that if you ask ChatGPT it will credit SRR for introducing the term to America. But the maitre de part of the story I heard years ago and can't confirm.

The earliest known use of the noun entourage is in the 1850s. OED's earliest evidence for entourage is from 1850, in the writing of William Thackeray, novelist. entourage is a borrowing from

[Kid Cauliflower]

The earliest known use of the noun entourage is in the 1850s. OED's earliest evidence for entourage is from 1850, in the writing of William Thackeray, novelist. entourage is a borrowing from

Excellent. We might expect a great English writer. I wonder about the first time it was listed in a dictionary?

[Willie Pep 229]

The earliest known use of the noun entourage is in the 1850s. OED's earliest evidence for entourage is from 1850, in the writing of William Thackeray, novelist. entourage is a borrowing from

Yes but I found a usage graph that shows the sudden jump in 1950 matching SRR return to America.

Much like the term "Upset" - which existed before the horse beat Man 'O War but became common in usage only after the the horse won the race.

This article suggests that the term hit England as early as 1832.




Screenshot_20240702_133027_Chrome.jpg

[billeau2]

Yet another example of the impact of prize fighting on the American lexicon.

Story goes . . . When SRR did his European championship tour, mostly in France, 1950, a French maitre de announced Sugar Ray to a dinner party as "Mr. Sugar Ray Robinson and his entourage."

Sugar Ray loved the way it sounded and upon his return to the States fed the term to the American sport writers who in turn made it part of the American English lexicon.

Before SRR and his "entourage" most groups that followed a prize fighter about, were referred to by the press as the fighter's "retinue."

l wonder if this is true. I do know that if you ask ChatGPT it will credit SRR for introducing the term to America. But the maitre de part of the story I heard years ago and can't confirm.

Very interesting! I love the term Retinue. What a perfect word to describe such a group. Entourage is also a very smart descriptive.

So Pep... It almost seems like the division between the colorful (Anglo Saxon descriptive terms for the bodily functions, curse words, informal lingo) and more formal language was utilized much better back when. Meinken makes reference to how slang developed as part of dialects, but it has been said that if we were walking into a pub early 19th century, we would hardly understand a word uttered... But what is retained is interesting. For example, a more colorful reference to Dempsey's "Retinue" or Ray Robinson's "entourage" arriving might be: "The Boys are here." It seems making reference to youth was a theme: We had so many "Kid ____ (Kid McCoy forb example)" Or Proper pronoun to adjective as in "Billy the Kid."

This reference to eternal youth, seems a characteristic the emerging United States of America had with ancient Sumeria as in "The Epic of Gilgamesh." Coding kicked in and made use of the term "Retinue" forthe boys, which was eventually eclipsed by the language of diplomacy (can one say no in French?) working through a very resourceful Matre D. Language evolves, probably why censorship is so awful. Great catch!!

[billeau2]

I can tell you it was not in Webster's 1828 edition of American Dictionary of the English Language.

Websters often enough, is a very abridged dictionary. Would be interesting to see if it was an unabridged, quality dictionary.