Hip Hop is a low artform, and I'm being generous here

[Derranged]

Rapping aint as easy as it looks. Have you ever listened to Kobe Bryant or Roy Jones Jr. rap?? It cant be done effectively by everybody.

[res]

To be fair, the critic is right.

The majority of hip hop is low artform like he says.

They have no great innovators. Like Pink Floyd to rock music. Jimi to blues. James to Soul. D'Angelo to neo-soul. Sabbath to metal. etc. etc.

Oh, and alot of the crap 'underground'...is......yeah you guessed it...crap.

Just a bunch of englishy nerds trying to rap.

2pac may not have the lyrics of a meth or monche, but dude can straight up spit and make some nice songs. Touching songs. Keep Ya Head up or Dear Mama isn't genius from a poet level...but in terms of affecting the masses...yeah those are ****ing ****ers.

In summary, artists like 2pac> Wutank, Monch, Rakim etc.

You are comparing Rakim to the Wu tang Clan and Pharoah Monch in the area of meaningful lyrics? .


Tupac is emotional, but usually not that deep.

As I have said before, even the lyrics to the song In The ****** by Rakim are deeper than anything I have ever heard from Tupac.

[-Antonio-]

Lupe Fiasco is an artist in every sense of the word.

[Moon]

It's an unfortunate cultural phenomenon, especially when you consider it arose primarily in the same country and among the same race that invented and developed jazz. Even more unfortunate is that kids worldwide have wasted their time listening to this.

Very bold statements here. All quite defensible as I see it.

I liken rap to a form of Urban-Folk, except that it hasn't inhereted any of the musical depth of the true Folk music.

Rap had more promise than it has delivered. It's now a si mple "Pop" event that will be swallowed over time.

I also liken rap to karaoke. It's often nothing more than a studio-created loop of sound that somebody puts vocals over. Not exactly the stuff that creates true musical legend, but is great for creating Urban Legend.

[The Critic]

What about play on words, delivery, or flow? You don't feel Hip Hop has contributed in that way at all, kayjay?

Who's kayjay?

If hip hop has made a musical contribution it has to have something to do with "flow." I don't know how to place this concept, and I don't find it to be used consistently. But probably there's something to be said for it.

[oldgringo]

Who's kayjay?

If hip hop has made a musical contribution it has to have something to do with "flow." I don't know how to place this concept, and I don't find it to be used consistently. But probably there's something to be said for it.

shut it geronimo.

[Still Pimpin]

Hip Hop is the pinnacle of all music. Hip Hop is the ultimate art form. There are hints of every type of music you can think of in hip hop.

I admit it's been extremely hard to listen to the radio for at least a decade now with the exception of a few artist who've held it down for years. I strongly believe The Music Business has made an attempt to break are culture and art down to a science when hip hop is completely the opposite of a science, it's a lifestyle. Because of the business ventures that made many undeserving artist rich for the wrong reasons we've suffered a loss.. We are missing the main element "soul".

Now that the internet is taking the entire music industry by storm I believe you will hear some of the most creative innovative musical peices come from the world of hip hop.

In other words, we were at are best before selling out became so honorable, but all that is about to change. I can't count how many rappers complain about not having full freedom of expression.

Furthermore, hip hop is such a dominant art form wev'e remained one of the most if not the most popular genre of music to come about in the 20 century regardless of the lack of emotion and lyrical content.

Let's be realistic here.......... Hip Hop is known for it's violent nature but so is the UFC, Boxing, Quinton Tarrentino...... **** Steven King for that matter. It's funny how we are view as such a low art form but Carl Rove attempts to gain publicity by dressing as a rapper and acting a damn fool...... Why not Aerosmith ?..... or Phil Collins ?

Ok let talk about grammer, does the average American English proffesor or politician speak like someone from England would ? After all it is the English language. Why is it a word like "fat" can be translated as "phat" and all of a sudden the world is speaking the same language ? To be truthful hip hop may be the most ENTERTAINING form of art other than film known to man.

Hip Hop was and truly is a no holds barred art form ..... the only rule is that your **** be raw = *( tight, hard, dope, sick, ill, gangsta, crunk, beatin', etc..
Bottom line hip hop is the most universal art form known to man = 48 bars 3 hooks and a break. you may not want strings to put together a hard rock album and you may not need heavy guitars to conduct a symphony but put it in the studio with a hip hop producers and a rapper and if talented the result will be more heart felt than any Orchestra could ever be and more exciting than any rock song could be. Many times there is more creativity in 8 bars of a rap song than an entire song by Celine Dion, or Mettalica, etc.. not to mention the fact the most songs in other genres repeat the same 8 bars most of the damn song.

Ask Phil Collins to rap and play the guitar and see what you get. Let's be real here holding a 4 bar note versus filling in each beat with additive thought broken down into syllables.

I'm gonna touch on neutral turf here, take one of Emenim's versus of his Marshal Mathers LP and compare that with any other verse from any other genre of music and tell us how they match up as far as creativity, emotion, excitement, humor, and delivery...... He's just one of many.....


I think I've made my point.......You just don't like rap and it bothers you that the vast majority of the modern world Eat, Sleep, ****, and Breathe it.

[black.ink]

Hip Hop is the pinnacle of all music. Hip Hop is the ultimate art form. There are hints of every type of music you can think of in hip hop.

I admit it's been extremely hard to listen to the radio for at least a decade now with the exception of a few artist who've held it down for years. I strongly believe The Music Business has made an attempt to break are culture and art down to a science when hip hop is completely the opposite of a science, it's a lifestyle. Because of the business ventures that made many undeserving artist rich for the wrong reasons we've suffered a loss.. We are missing the main element "soul".

Now that the internet is taking the entire music industry by storm I believe you will hear some of the most creative innovative musical peices come from the world of hip hop.

In other words, we were at are best before selling out became so honorable, but all that is about to change. I can't count how many rappers complain about not having full freedom of expression.

Furthermore, hip hop is such a dominant art form wev'e remained one of the most if not the most popular genre of music to come about in the 20 century regardless of the lack of emotion and lyrical content.

Let's be realistic here.......... Hip Hop is known for it's violent nature but so is the UFC, Boxing, Quinton Tarrentino...... **** Steven King for that matter. It's funny how we are view as such a low art form but Carl Rove attempts to gain publicity by dressing as a rapper and acting a damn fool...... Why not Aerosmith ?..... or Phil Collins ?

Ok let talk about grammer, does the average American English proffesor or politician speak like someone from England would ? After all it is the English language. Why is it a word like "fat" can be translated as "phat" and all of a sudden the world is speaking the same language ? To be truthful hip hop may be the most ENTERTAINING form of art other than film known to man.

Hip Hop was and truly is a no holds barred art form ..... the only rule is that your **** be raw = *( tight, hard, dope, sick, ill, gangsta, crunk, beatin', etc..
Bottom line hip hop is the most universal art form known to man = 48 bars 3 hooks and a break. you may not want strings to put together a hard rock album and you may not need heavy guitars to conduct a symphony but put it in the studio with a hip hop producers and a rapper and if talented the result will be more heart felt than any Orchestra could ever be and more exciting than any rock song could be. Many times there is more creativity in 8 bars of a rap song than an entire song by Celine Dion, or Mettalica, etc.. not to mention the fact the most songs in other genres repeat the same 8 bars most of the damn song.

Ask Phil Collins to rap and play the guitar and see what you get. Let's be real here holding a 4 bar note versus filling in each beat with additive thought broken down into syllables.

I'm gonna touch on neutral turf here, take one of Emenim's versus of his Marshal Mathers LP and compare that with any other verse from any other genre of music and tell us how they match up as far as creativity, emotion, excitement, humor, and delivery...... He's just one of many.....


I think I've made my point.......You just don't like rap and it bothers you that the vast majority of the modern world Eat, Sleep, ****, and Breathe it.

You make some great points, but the only problem i have in the statement i have highlighted is that you're comparing a whole genre of music to just one band.

If you listen to Metallica's 'Ride The Lightning' album, i can reverse your statement and say there is more Creativity in that 1 album then most rappers have in there whole careers. 'Fade To Black' for instance has a deep symphonical sound not to mention a breathtaking guitar solo, as the same in the 'Call of Ktulu', a 9 minute instumental track, with great musical arrangement.

This is followed and is evident in later albums, 'Master of puppets' and '....Justice For All', adding more acoustic melodies.

The reason i am defending the band, is that they are a favourite of mine, and that points in some threads are being contradicted in defending a genre which i highly respect, then putting other genres down in the same manner that if you don't like it....DON'T LISTEN to it.

[The Critic]

Hip Hop is the pinnacle of all music. Hip Hop is the ultimate art form. There are hints of every type of music you can think of in hip hop.

I admit it's been extremely hard to listen to the radio for at least a decade now with the exception of a few artist who've held it down for years. I strongly believe The Music Business has made an attempt to break are culture and art down to a science when hip hop is completely the opposite of a science, it's a lifestyle. Because of the business ventures that made many undeserving artist rich for the wrong reasons we've suffered a loss.. We are missing the main element "soul".

This is a bunch of nonsense here.

Are you even familiar with traditional forms of music?

[Killa Cam]

If you found good lyrics

simple, sick ****in story

Now I used to walk with the gun now I walk like a man
And I walk what I talk and I walk never ran
And I never say never but I mean hardly ever
And if shootin' is the solution then you're not that clever
If you don't know **** then you still know better
Human life is so precious it could never be measured
Have you ever had a load of it **** back the heat
Poppin' on the next ***** while he walkin' up the street
Trigger off safety spacin an opportunity
These *****z wanna waste me it ain't nothing new to me
Soon as he walked by I was ready to bust
But he just posted up like he was waitin' on the bus
Now I'm all punked up with a steroid trigger
Cause most of y'all are easy just some paranoid *****z
Used to walk with a gun but I never did use it
What's the point of holdin' heat if you ain't gon' shoot it
****** (*echos*)

*different instrumental kicks in*

[Verse 2 - MURS]
It was a late night sunset me and him out
Lookin' at the ladies tryin to come up on some trim
Everybody wildin' out cause the summer's about to end
He had the hypnotic he was mixin with the hen'
Off that mean green laid back with the deep lean on low pro ****
That's how we rolled on the scene
Two girls lookin' probably in they late teens
But these days you can't tell but I figured what the hell
So we yell out: Hey girl, they yell back
Maybe two in the front maybe two in the back
But they had this dark tint couldn't see through the black
We roll up ask 'em where their party at
They just start to laugh and I knew it was a trap
But I couldn't roll out cause the strip was so packed
Now I'm lookin at this ***** in this mother****in' hat
Start talkin' that bull**** like we was on some bull****
My ***** used to **** but we ain't on no thug ****
I tried to dismantle it but you know Los Angeles
This ***** kept talkin' so my boy had to handle it
He jumped out the Lex snatched the dude at his hat
I put it in park jumped out to get his back
But as I did that, I heared two shots
I turned to my right and I seen my dude drop
Time stopped, couldn't believe what I seen
I was struck by reality when the two girls screamed
I saw his killer stand up put the gun in his jeans
Saw him wince from the pain as the heat burned his waist
Then he turned up the block disappeared without a trace
I remember his face but what I remember most
Was when I got to my knees and held my ***** close
And asked not to leave us in the name of Christ Jesus
But he's gone and all I got left is his blood on my sneakers

[Hook - MURS][2X]
It was a year to this day that my best friend died
For weeks I sat alone in my room and cried
And I tried to pretend everything was fine
But my soul couldn't rest until vengeance was mine

*another different instrumental kicks in*

[Verse 3 - MURS]
The day began with me standin' at his grave with his mother
His old girlfriend, his two younger brothers
We said a few words faces covered with tears
How we missed him so much and we wished he was here
Then his girl said a poem put some roses on his stone
And we said our goodbyes and they all went home
I thought I'd use this time for me and him to be alone
I broke out the Hen' poured a little out for him
Told him who was gettin' married, who had went to the pen
How the homie named his newborn son after him
But as the sun went down the talk came to an end
So I said a quick prayer..amen
And I shook in the lac' plus the well wrote tracks
And I headed up saw the homie Eyezeer
I asked him what he doin' he was way out of bound
That he had a freak that lived on that side of town
He always kept the heat just in case it went down
A clown, I rolled down my window 'bout to light a ciga-
Hey! Is that that ***** that...hey give me the mother****ing gun
Man, drive around the block and post up for a minute
If I hit you on the chirp hit the corner ***** bend it
Splendid now with vengeance in my grasp
I couldn't dream of a better day for me to catch his ass
Slippin while he dippin into the ride by himself
I slid up behind him in the shadows hella stealth
He started to break himself I said I didn't want a dime
Remember what you was doin' last year at this time
He looked into my eyes with both shock and surprise
When I split his face with the Glock right before he could reply
He cried, as I pressed the heat against his cheek
Then I squoze two times for the homie rest in peace

[Hook - MURS]
It was a year to this day that my best friend died
For weeks I sat alone in my room and cried
And I tried to pretend everything was fine
But my soul couldn't rest until vengeance was mine
It was a year to this day that my best friend died
For weeks I sat alone in my room and cried
And I thought that's what I wanted until the problem was confronted
Now I'm haunted by remorse that I wished I hadn't done it...(****)