Waddell investment down to the last 82M? OUT of (521M)

[PKing]

Swing the pendulum back to the status quo- hbo, showtime, arum, sanctioning bodies

How would Arum benefit from PBC getting only 200k per show fees?

[PKing]

Thanks to PBC many of the top fighters want mega million dollar pay days for average fights resulting in many fights not being made. Look at Quillen. He wants may/pac money to fight GGG.

Has any PBC fighter earned more than 2 million for a fight?

[HeroBando]

Swing the pendulum back to the status quo- hbo, showtime, arum, sanctioning bodies

Let's hope both networks are still as committed to boxing then. Lots of cable cutting going around, and Showtime is increasingly getting terrible **** for the buck in their boxing programming. They used to spend 10x less, get similar ratings, and deliver more memorable fights

[HeroBando]

Has any PBC fighter earned more than 2 million for a fight?

Maybe Chavez for Fonfara, seems as though Haymon paid him on the side illegally. He posted the check on twitter lol.

[Sugar Adam Ali]

How would Arum benefit from PBC getting only 200k per show fees?

Haymon has been paying huge amounts, and has basically signed tons of talent.. Hos stable is much larger than any other.. If haymon has to cut back on his purses, then guys like chavez jr, khan, etc may not be as willing to sign.. Since the rise of pbc, the rosters on arum and golden boy have become pretty bare. They really only got 2 legit draws in manny and canelo. PBC faulters, I can see top rank and golden boy restocking their stables with some more name guys while their prospects develop

[Mitchell Kane]

HBO is paying $30 million for boxing. FOX is paying $100 million for UFC. Even with Haymon dominating HBO, what would his cut of the pie be? $20 million?

That $100 million price tag is probably not a good benchmark to use when projecting what the PBC might get in a network deal...and it may not even be that similar to what the UFC gets for it's next deal.

From the FOX side, the UFC deal was about more than just a few live fight cards that would be televised on regular FOX.

It was about FOX networks becoming the exclusive television home of the UFC.

Most of the UFC content that airs on the FOX networks is on cable (on FS1 and FS2, which weren't even around when FOX signed the deal)...and it includes original fight cards, prelims of fights on FOX/PPV, weigh-in coverage, pre/post fight coverage, The Ultimate Fighter, Countdown, Embedded, UFC Tonight, as well as their inventory of past fights which they air on shows like Ultimate Knockouts.

That's really apples to oranges with what the PBC has to offer, which is primarily just fights (live and on replay).

The PBC did attempt to supplement their live boxing with the Corner to Corner show, but that didn't really seem to catch on.

[original zero]

Mitchell -

And once the time buys are up, a network will have the opportunity to become the exclusive television home of PBC.

If, for instance, Viacom secures the rights, they'll have boxing for CBS, Spike and Showtime while also taking away boxing from NBC, NBC Sports, FOX, FS1 and ESPN.

Those networks can try to get back into the boxing business if they want, but if Haymon is Viacom exclusive and HBO has TR, GB, ME & K2 by the balls, the level of boxing available would be minimal.

You say $100 million is too high, but Haymon doesn't need $100 million for this to be a success. He just needs more than what he was getting from HBO. If he was getting $20 million from HBO let's say (and even that may be generous), that is a wide gap between what HBO was paying and what FOX is paying for UFC.

With PBC doing the same ratings as UFC, I'd say there's a very good chance PBC can secure a deal that pays more than what HBO was paying. Even if it's only half of what UFC gets, it's still way way more than HBO was giving Haymon.

Haymon is trying to expand the business. Why be a rat chasing your tail ad infinitum settling for whatever scraps HBO sends your way? The only way to grow the business was to break out of the HBO model and show the networks that millions will watch boxing on network TV.

And with PBC also trying to kill PPV, they can offer Viacom or FOX something that UFC can't . . . *their biggest fights!*

[Mitchell Kane]

You say $100 million is too high

No I didn't.

[original zero]

"That $100 million price tag is probably not a good benchmark to use when projecting what the PBC might get in a network deal"


hahahaha that's not you saying $100 million is too high of an estimate of what PBC might get?

[bigdunny1]

Let's continue to expose the flaws in Dunny's logic shall we . . .

Because UFC once aired on Spike and because PBC has aired on Spike, a simple minded fellow like Dunny believes the most logical thing is to compare Spike vs Spike.

Why is this illogical? Because Spike was UFC's most prominent broadcasting partner while Spike is PBC's 5th or 6th most prominent broadcasting partner. If we're looking at UFC's most successful program, wouldn't it make the most sense to compare it to PBC's most successful program instead of their 5th or 6th tier network? Of course. But Dunny thinks he can fool you guys with his amateur attempt at slick double talk.

So if by your own words UFC was the most prominent broadcasting on SPIKE which is the genesis of why they got their 100 mil TV deal with FOX and PBC is only the 5th or 6th and I already showed you the ratings which UFC did more then triple what PBC is doing then why would FOX pay 100mil for it like your re tarded @ss said earlier? But glad you even admit how insignificant the ratings are on SPIKE

But what's even better is that even if you wanted to compare the same network against the same network, would the most logical thing be to compare Spike vs Spike when UFC was already off of Spike years before PBC existed? Or would the most logical thing be to compare UFC & PBC on FOX in back to back weeks?!?

BECAUSE PBC just debuted (when you get the most ratings) and UFC is 4 years in. Why do you keep refusing to compare UFC debut on Fox to PBC debut on FOX? And love how you keep ignoring my one simple question if instead of pulling 1.7mil ratings on Spike if UFC was pulling PBC 0.5mil ratings would FOX of paid UFC 100mil? Especially when PBC costs far more to produce.

OF COURSE the most logical thing would be to compare the ratings from the same network ONE WEEK APART *this year* instead of YEARS APART, YEARS AGO. But Dunny thinks he can fool you guys with his amateur attempt at slick double talk.

PBC & UFC ratings on FOX in January were *virtually identical*. Now Dunny claims that FOX overpaid for UFC. Let's even say that's true. Unless Dunny believes that UFC's next TV deal will be for $20 million (80% decrease), there is no reason to believe PBC won't land a deal that pays more than what HBO was paying Haymon.

Identical I thought PBC's were better? Oh yeah you lied about that and I exposed you. UFC did better then PBC's F'ing DEBUT at a fraction of the cost. I showed you a link with the fighter purses which are like 1/10 the amount PBC just paid for it's DEBUT that did less ratings then UFC. And unlike UFC they already got their money from FOX.

When confronted with this fact, Dunny refused to comment. Suddenly the guy that never shuts up, even when he has no idea what he's talking, was speechless. Because deep down he knows he's in checkmate. No matter how you spin it, all Haymon has to do is land a deal that pays more than HBO was paying him.

Idiot first you screamed that PBC was going to get the same deal UFC got now when I give you the facts which point out at every step UFC out performed PBC and how it's impossible for a worse performing product to get that same amount deal. Now you switch up and are saying they will get a HBO type deal when in reality nothing PBC has done proves ANYONE will pay a single dime for a expensive weak performing PBC that loses millions each event they put on. But at least you smartened up and gave the fairy tale 100mil TV deal crap a rest.

And networks spend SO MUCH MORE for sports than what HBO spends, that it is a virtual guarantee that PBC will land a better deal than what Haymon had with HBO previously.

The problem here is that Dunny is so small minded, complex concepts or long term planning go right over his head. He's baffled by why PBC has less events now than last year.

Last year, PBC flooded the market with events to get their name out there as quickly and as broadly as possible. They also locked up every TV deal they could. If they didn't agree to the FS1 events, FS1 would have struck a deal with someone else. If they didn't agree to the Spike events, Spike would have struck a deal with someone else.

These were networks that were going to do boxing either way and Haymon made sure to box everybody else out. There was never a need for Haymon to run weekly events, but he had to run enough to keep others off these networks. Same thing with ESPN. Haymon doesn't need ESPN, but if he doesn't make the ESPN deal, ESPN would have made a deal with someone else.

HERE IS THE LATEST LOAD OF CRAP. Did you just say the reason the amount of PBC events have fallen off a cliff is because Haymon bought all that TV time and simple doesn't want to air anything with it? DOES THAT MAKE SENSE TO ANYONE? Funny before Aug PBC aired about 3-4 shows a month and the only reason it was this low is because the FS1, ESPN, Bounce TV contracts did not kick in yet. By Aug they did and you saw a spike of 9-8 shows a month. Then something happened. The ratings were bad and numerous reports they were losing too much money. We now know those loses were in the hundreds of millions confirmed by numerous reports. And here is the amount of PBC events per month brake down

Aug - 5 shows
Sept - 9 shows
Oct - 8 shows
Nov - 5 shows
Dec - 4 shows
Jan - 4 shows
Feb - 2 shows (THE LOWEST since PBC debut)
March - 0 scheduled (It's Feb 2nd and not a single event confirmed yet)

Starting in the fall at the same time stories come out that PBC is losing more money then they anticipated numerous fights start getting shipped to Showtime. Haymon's biggest names either take the year off or fight their next fights on Showtime INSTEAD of PBC because they can't afford them. 2 of the biggest fights PBC announced Jacobs vs Quillin and Thurman vs Porter one get's shuffled off PBC to Showtime and the second get's pushed out of 2015 and delayed month after month and finally a day before it's officially announced is shipped to Showtime and will not be branded PBC even though it's still on CBS (BECAUSE PBC already paid for the air time) but will be branded Showtime on CBS because PBC couldn't pay for the fighters purses and production costs. And now Feb will be the lowest amount of PBC shows since it debuted even though they already paid for the air time on 8 different networks they simple choose not to use it? BS the reason the amount of shows in FEB are so low are the same reason for this thread. They have burned through too much money and can't afford to pay for all the shows for these dates they already purchased from the networks. HENCE March 12 being a "Showtime on CBS" fight and not a PBC fight.