Hypothetically...If Tyson Fury

[MoneyKing]

Tyson Fury equals Led Zeppelin


The PBC or PVC and Matchroom are like Pink Floyd and The Who hating on the good name.


Facts.

[billeau2]

I don't. At all.

It might help a bit to clarify that the list is IF Fury beats Usyk... I think some may have forgotten that fact. Either way, it is a tough sell lol. My own feelings are: Lists are hard to justify objectively and I look at the skill, justification of the list maker as existential in nature. Wilder was insanely capable of knocking out opponents and on film it shows... Usyk beat Joshua which is somewhat diminished these days lol...

[psychofusion]

If you are putting Klitschko in this era then you can't have him at 10. That's insane.

[Willow The Wisp]

This wasn't supposed to be a discussion of Wilders place in the pantheon; but.....

Wilders best win is Ortiz, then his second best is errr...Arreola? Helenius? (who Joshua also beat), Stiverne? Gerald Washington? how the **** is that enough to put him over Usyk who has beaten Fury, Dubois and Joshua x2? or even over Joshua who has beaten Wlad, Parker, Povetkin, Whyte, Pulev, Ruiz, Martin, Wallin in addition to several of Wilders better wins in Helenius, Breazele and Molina?

Even Dubois, Parker and Zhang have arguably surpassed Wilders resume in terms of meaningful high end wins at this point.

Wilder above Usyk is absurd. Wilder couldn’t beat Fury in 3 attempts, Usyk did it first time. Wilder held one belt, Usyk unified them all. Also has wins over AJ x2 and Dubois which is better than anything on Wilder’s resume.

Not sure if you’re trolling but if that’s a serious take, then wow…

It is certainly a debateable point regarding Wilder's lofty placement on the list that shows a hypothetical of Usyk getting blown out in the rematch.
Usyk getting beaten badly in the scenario accounts for his dropping to number three.

But....My argument in defense of Wilder always factors in things such as:

Undefeated until age 34, at 42-0-1 (Matched only by Marciano and Holmes).

10 successful title defenses, the leading figure of the era.

A 2008 Olympics medalist.

The highest KO - to - win% of any major heavyweight beltholder in history (97.67%).

Meaningful (and semi-meaningful) wins over Harrison, Liakhovich, Scott, Stiverne (2), Molina, Duhaupas, Szpilka, Arreola, Washington, Ortiz (2), Breazeale, Helenius and a draw against reigning lineal champion Fury to unify.
Everything the WBC asked of him; which was his one obligation as long as he held their title.

CERTAINLY, Not as good an opponent collection as several others in his era had, but he scored stunning knockouts and knockdowns over them all without a single loss during his prime.
Aside from Usyk, who else has done that?

The "meaningful high end wins" list is, of course, a vitally important factor when making these relative assessments, and perhaps the single most important one; but it does not stand up alone.

I throw out his lukewarm nod against Parker and KO loss to Zhang as a 48 fight veteran approaching 40 having passed his prime, and look forward to what folks like Joshua, Parker and Dubois will be doing at that age.

It all adds up; as do the 10 in-prime losses suffered by Joshua, Whyte and Parker.

The actual body of work quotiant that seperates those among the best of the era is razor thin, and it’s perfectly all right for others to shout out for their faves.

[RJJ-94-02=GOAT]

This wasn't supposed to be a discussion of Wilders place in the pantheon; but.....






It is certainly a debateable point regarding Wilder's lofty placement on the list that shows a hypothetical of Usyk getting blown out in the rematch.
Usyk getting beaten badly in the scenario accounts for his dropping to number three.

But....My argument in defense of Wilder always factors in things such as:

Undefeated until age 34, at 42-0-1 (Matched only by Marciano and Holmes).

10 successful title defenses, the leading figure of the era.

A 2008 Olympics medalist.

The highest KO - to - win% of any major heavyweight beltholder in history (97.67%).

Meaningful (and semi-meaningful) wins over Harrison, Liakhovich, Scott, Stiverne (2), Molina, Duhaupas, Szpilka, Arreola, Washington, Ortiz (2), Breazeale, Helenius and a draw against reigning lineal champion Fury to unify.
Everything the WBC asked of him; which was his one obligation as long as he held their title.

CERTAINLY, Not as good an opponent collection as several others in his era had, but he scored stunning knockouts and knockdowns over them all without a single loss during his prime.
Aside from Usyk, who else has done that?

The "meaningful high end wins" list is, of course, a vitally important factor when making these relative assessments, and perhaps the single most important one; but it does not stand up alone.

I throw out his lukewarm nod against Parker and KO loss to Zhang as a 48 fight veteran approaching 40 having passed his prime, and look forward to what folks like Joshua, Parker and Dubois will be doing at that age.

It all adds up; as do the 10 in-prime losses suffered by Joshua, Whyte and Parker.

The actual body of work quotiant that seperates those among the best of the era is razor thin, and it’s perfectly all right for others to shout out for their faves.

Wilder was badly beaten by Fury twice himself though, so how would that hypothetical result lower Usyk beneath him?

10 defences is an impressive feat but it’s important to consider it was 10 defences of a heavyweight title not the heavyweight title which only Wladimir, Fury and Usyk have held within this era. The fact Usyk also became undisputed champion puts him leagues above Wilder IMO.

[Willow The Wisp]

Wilder was badly beaten by Fury twice himself though, so how would that hypothetical result lower Usyk beneath him?

10 defences is an impressive feat but it’s important to consider it was 10 defences of a heavyweight title not the heavyweight title which only Wladimir, Fury and Usyk have held within this era. The fact Usyk also became undisputed champion puts him leagues above Wilder IMO.

And if Usyk beats Fury again he'll clinch the era hands down, leaving the rest of them in the dust.

[Willow The Wisp]

Also, the wins over Chisora and Dubois have aged remarkably well.

[RJJ-94-02=GOAT]

And if Usyk beats Fury again he'll clinch the era hands down, leaving the rest of them in the dust.

Unquestionably. He’s head and shoulders above the rest atm. Fury is the only guy even within reach of him IMO.

[The D3vil]

I think it would put him in the top 20 all-time at HW.

Now, he's about top 25

[hugh grant]

It'd help Furys legacy obviously but people would want a third fight to settle things. It'd be weird for them to retire at 1-1.

There doesn't need to be a 3rd. Usually winner of rematch is considered better, and thought to have had bad day at office in first fight.
But if Fury beats usyk, fury can be top 10.