Comments Thread For: Manny Pacquiao Handler: 'Beating Spence Would Be Greatest Win In Welterweight History'

[The Big Dunn]

Because your justification makes no sense, that's why. Not all fighters today are competing and winning at the highest levels. Just the special ones. I love the Fab 4, but none of them, not even Duran, competed at the top level of the sport as consistently and as long as Pac. I'm not even a Pac fan and I can say that. As I said earlier, the fights you mention as being greater achievements were supposed to be competitive.

In your earlier message you stated that context was important in your assessment, then you mentioned the fallacy that Duran had to come up two weight classes to challenge SRL at WW. The fact that you were summarily corrected about that false context didn't change a thing for you, so context doesn't really matter to you.

I didn’t question any of the things you posted about in the first paragraph. I took all that into consideration and that is why I would rank it 3rd if it happened.

Of course my justification makes sense. I take more into consideration than just Manny’s age. I’m talking about wins that changed the landscape of the division and are still talked about today.

If I am wrong on that that was just one piece of the reasoning I gave why I thought it was the best ww win. If I am wrong, ( I will check and exit below) then it would obviously take a bit away but not enough for me to think it still wasn’t the best ww win in the modern era.

I also pointed out the context the Spence/Manny fight takes place and how that impact why I would rate it 3rd.

How anyone thinks that is unfair or an insult is just mind boggling.

edit: I checked and it appears he last defended the LW title in Feb 1979 and then had 5 fights between then and Leonard.

[wrecksracer]

———
Since we are being “honest”, let’s go the extra mile in honesty, shall we?
Spence is 31 years old. He traveled to England to win his first belt. Let’s be clear about that. He has another 5 years to build on his legacy.

Do you know who Manny fought starting at 32 years old?
Brandon Rios, Broner, Vargas, Mathysse, Etc … were these guys better than Porter or Danny Garcia?

Let's be honest, Manny already had a Hall of Fame record at 32. He had already traveled out of his country multiple times to fight for championships where he was the underdog. You already know this, right? Spence has been slumming. 32 and that's all he has to show for it? Get out of here. Thurman beat the best 2 guys on Spence's record. And who beat Thurman?

[hugh grant]

This post right here shows why Manny diehards are so despised.

I posted if he wins it would be the 3rd best ww win I. 40+ years. The only 2 wins I put above it are legendary wins by 2 of the consensus 5 or 7 greatest boxers that ever lived.
.

Saying it would be 3rd best W W in last 40 years isn't good enough.
A 43 year old Duran or SRL obviously wouldn't beat spence, and we don't know if prime SRL and Duran would beat spence.
if Pac beats spence, then we would know a 43 year old Pac did beat spence and only think a prime SRL and Duran would beat spence. So Pac did, and the others only coulda, woulda.
Just because Duran is greater historically than spence doesn't mean he beats spence. He didn't beat Kirkland so we don't give automatic wins

[FLY TY]

Errol Spence is barely a 2-1 favorite (somehow). Pump the brakes, Mosley was a bigger underdog against Margarito.

[Oregonian]

Let's be honest, Manny already had a Hall of Fame record at 32. He had already traveled out of his country multiple times to fight for championships where he was the underdog. You already know this, right? Spence has been slumming. 32 and that's all he has to show for it? Get out of here. Thurman beat the best 2 guys on Spence's record. And who beat Thurman?

———
Well, to use your favorite line, again - “let’s be honest” … when you refer to PAC as “he had traveled out of his country multiple times to fight …” this statement just shows you don’t know shït about boxing,

Can you just answer this - if Manny had stayed in his country, would there be anyone for him to fight?? Every great fighter from any other third world country can only make his name and fortune in the US. Some can make their fortune in a few European nations.

Many great fighters stayed in the US and became multiple world champions with absolutely no need to travel overseas. Trying to use that fallacy on someone traveling from the Philippines is like saying ***embe Mutombo is the greatest because he left Africa to come play in the US. Where the fück else would he play?

To your other point about Manny being a HoF at 32, no one is dis*****g that. The fact is also he had three losses at 32 already (including two KO’s). And had already ducked several guys at 130 (Zaheer Rahim for one, beat Morales and then Manny went on to fight Morales). Manny also fought once at 135 beating a helpless no name David Diaz before moving.

Lastly, to use your illogical trifecta argument that’s never true in boxing, let’s do the same for Manny, shall we?
Manny beat Margarito who just been KO’d by Mosley.
Manny beat Mosley who had gotten beat by Floyd.
Manny beat Oscar and Hatton after they were beat by Floyd.
Manny beat Rios who had lost to Alvarado.
manny beat Broner who had two losses and a draw
Manny beat Cotto at a catchweight
Manny beat Mathysse and Vargas … both irrelevant at 147

Thurman was a great win for Manny. Nobody denies that.
And if he beats Spence, it becomes a greater win. Nobody denies that.

[Lefty0616]

I wonder if a win against Spence could finally force a rematch against Mayweather?

[Oregonian]

Saying it would be 3rd best W W in last 40 years isn't good enough.
A 43 year old Duran or SRL obviously wouldn't beat spence, and we don't know if prime SRL and Duran would beat spence.
if Pac beats spence, then we would know a 43 year old Pac did beat spence and only think a prime SRL and Duran would beat spence. So Pac did, and the others only coulda, woulda.
Just because Duran is greater historically than spence doesn't mean he beats spence. He didn't beat Kirkland so we don't give automatic wins

—-/
But yet you give an automatic hypothetic win for your boy Manny over Spence.
We bet SRL destroys guys like Broner, Mathysse, Algieri, Vargas, Bradley, David Diaz, Marquez, etc in spectacular KO’s too.

[Spoon23]

I don’t base the quality just on age of the boxers. Context is important.

Really? I think you're missing the bigger point. It's not that Spence is equal to early 80's Duran/SRL/Hearns,. Its that Duran, SRL and Hearns were all in their primes when they fought each other the first time. Pacquiao fighting a prime, reigning, undefeated, unified WW champion with an 11 year age advantage and every conceivable physical advantage is a far greater achievement than Duran beating SRL or SRL beating Hearns. Those fights were supposed to be competitive. Conventional wisdom says Spence vs. Pac should be a straight beat down. If Pacquiao wins this fight without controversy, it has to be regarded as one of the greatest feats in boxing history.

NachoMan just explained you the context BigDone.

And Bigdone goes down again.. how many more can this man take..

[wrecksracer]

———
Well, to use your favorite line, again - “let’s be honest” … when you refer to PAC as “he had traveled out of his country multiple times to fight …” this statement just shows you don’t know shït about boxing,

Can you just answer this - if Manny had stayed in his country, would there be anyone for him to fight?? Every great fighter from any other third world country can only make his name and fortune in the US. Some can make their fortune in a few European nations.

Many great fighters stayed in the US and became multiple world champions with absolutely no need to travel overseas. Trying to use that fallacy on someone traveling from the Philippines is like saying ***embe Mutombo is the greatest because he left Africa to come play in the US. Where the fück else would he play?

To your other point about Manny being a HoF at 32, no one is dis*****g that. The fact is also he had three losses at 32 already (including two KO’s). And had already ducked several guys at 130 (Zaheer Rahim for one, beat Morales and then Manny went on to fight Morales). Manny also fought once at 135 beating a helpless no name David Diaz before moving.

Lastly, to use your illogical trifecta argument that’s never true in boxing, let’s do the same for Manny, shall we?
Manny beat Margarito who just been KO’d by Mosley.
Manny beat Mosley who had gotten beat by Floyd.
Manny beat Oscar and Hatton after they were beat by Floyd.
Manny beat Rios who had lost to Alvarado.
manny beat Broner who had two losses and a draw
Manny beat Cotto at a catchweight
Manny beat Mathysse and Vargas … both irrelevant at 147

Thurman was a great win for Manny. Nobody denies that.
And if he beats Spence, it becomes a greater win. Nobody denies that.

You're acting like Spence fighting for his first title out of the country like it's a big deal. It isn't. Especially against Brook, who has one good win. I'm laughing at you. Your knowledge of boxing humors me. Spence barely beat Porter. Nobody thinks Porter is a great fighter. Spence is a PBC level champ. He should be able to beat a 42 year old, but looking at who he has fought, maybe not.

[NachoMan]

I didn’t question any of the things you posted about in the first paragraph. I took all that into consideration and that is why I would rank it 3rd if it happened.

Of course my justification makes sense. I take more into consideration than just Manny’s age. I’m talking about wins that changed the landscape of the division and are still talked about today.

If I am wrong on that that was just one piece of the reasoning I gave why I thought it was the best ww win. If I am wrong, ( I will check and exit below) then it would obviously take a bit away but not enough for me to think it still wasn’t the best ww win in the modern era.

I also pointed out the context the Spence/Manny fight takes place and how that impact why I would rate it 3rd.

How anyone thinks that is unfair or an insult is just mind boggling.

edit: I checked and it appears he last defended the LW title in Feb 1979 and then had 5 fights between then and Leonard.

I don't think your opinion is unfair or insulting. I just disagree with it. I like Pacquiao, but I almost never rooted for him in his fights for whatever reason (Broner and Floyd being the exception that I did), so its not anything emotional for me. Still, I just think that the challenge Pac has undertaken at 43 yrs old and the significance of the outcome would make a win greater than the fights you mention.