I have consensus top ten welterweights of all time

[danceken1]

I have went through 459 pages and got a consensus of your top ten welterweights of all time 44 people have written a top ten. I have given 10 points for first and 9 for second and so on 10th would get 1 point. I will post the list next Thursday the 18th of February if I can get at least 20 people to give me a top ten flyweight list. I am trying to make a consensus list of top ten boxers for every division. Thanks everyone If you have never given a welterweight top ten list and would like to be part of the consensus please post your list but I still need at least 20 people to post their top ten flyweight list before this list is shown. I went through every page on your history site to get the welterweight list. Thanks Kenney

[The Old LefHook]

I have went through 459 pages and got a consensus of your top ten welterweights of all time 44 people have written a top ten. I have given 10 points for first and 9 for second and so on 10th would get 1 point. I will post the list next Thursday the 18th of February if I can get at least 20 people to give me a top ten flyweight list. I am trying to make a consensus list of top ten boxers for every division. Thanks everyone If you have never given a welterweight top ten list and would like to be part of the consensus please post your list but I still need at least 20 people to post their top ten flyweight list before this list is shown. I went through every page on your history site to get the welterweight list. Thanks Kenney

We do not respond well to ultimatums. Give your list or shutup and go home, sonny. We are interested, but we sure as hell are not about to produce 20 flyweight lists.

[Ray Corso]

Sugar Ray Robinson is TBE at welter...........middle too! Everyone else is 2nd!
Mark Johnson is the best fly I've ever seen but theres others that could be better.
Right now I think Roman Gonzales is the P4P king and even though he's campaigning at 118 he was the top Flyweight. I think he's outstanding.
Ray

[billeau2]

When the fighters top out at my wife's weight (125) I feel strange about it...Its my problem but I go as high as lightweight.

Are there even ten flyweights?

[billeau2]

We do not respond well to ultimatums. Give your list or shutup and go home, sonny. We are interested, but we sure as hell are not about to produce 20 flyweight lists.

Two flyweights against a good middle weight!

Lefty I bet you are not married...How can I tell you ask? Your first sentence to the OP.

[Syf]

Lefty I bet you are not married...How can I tell you ask? Your first sentence to the OP.

Hahahaha..

Well played!

[The Old LefHook]

Two flyweights against a good middle weight!

Lefty I bet you are not married...How can I tell you ask? Your first sentence to the OP.

You can probably tell I used to be.

[billeau2]

You can probably tell I used to be.

I remember when I said, I don't want a dog! And I took her fifteen rounds, we had these really abused dogs we had tried to take care of in louisiana and I just didn't want to deal with it anymore....

As I type this right now beans and Roscoe are watching me because....if you get one dog, they need a brother!!! How the hell we got from a dog to two, I can't even remember! I love both these guys though wouldn't have it any other way...

I remember when we had our first son and I figured in this overpopulated world, we might eventually adapt...same thing!!!! YOu can't have just one....I lasted 4 years on that one

I weigh in at 250 or so and can look menancing if I want....so how does a 125er kick my azz every time?

But same thing: can't imagine life without my two boys...they get you through attrition!! every time!!

[McGoorty]

Sugar Ray Robinson is TBE at welter...........middle too! Everyone else is 2nd!
Mark Johnson is the best fly I've ever seen but theres others that could be better.
Right now I think Roman Gonzales is the P4P king and even though he's campaigning at 118 he was the top Flyweight. I think he's outstanding.
Ray

I am not so sure as you are about that Bob, Tommy Ryan needs real consideration here, his record is one of the best in history, only two losses and one by DQ and the other he was tricked into thinking it was to be little more than an exhibition. Many of the writers, fighters, trainers and managers who saw him fight say he was better than any fighter in WW or MW in the 10's 20's... that includes Harry Greb and others I am too tired to mention now. Ryans great rival Mysterious Billy Smith a few of those guys insist would also beat all the fighters in said eras. Sugar Ray is regarded as the best by so many but also none of those people ever saw Ryan fight.

[The Old LefHook]

I am not so sure as you are about that Bob, Tommy Ryan needs real consideration here, his record is one of the best in history, only two losses and one by DQ and the other he was tricked into thinking it was to be little more than an exhibition. Many of the writers, fighters, trainers and managers who saw him fight say he was better than any fighter in WW or MW in the 10's 20's... that includes Harry Greb and others I am too tired to mention now. Ryans great rival Mysterious Billy Smith a few of those guys insist would also beat all the fighters in said eras. Sugar Ray is regarded as the best by so many but also none of those people ever saw Ryan fight.

Neither did you. It is all apocryphal storytelling. I respect your attention to history. Advocating too strongly for boxers lost in the fog of time is similar to someone claiming Theogenes was the best boxer who ever lived. Who cares that he fought around 500 B.B.? The stories say he was great and his record is unrivaled in the history of hand-to-hand combat sports.

I am not dis*****g what you say. I think you have superior knowledge of Ryan to myself. All such evidence must by the nature of it be the very indirect kind, though, of examining records and reading apocryphal stories many years after the fact. Of course that is much of what we do here on the history section. You are doing what you are supposed to do, but so am I. These debates on oldtimer vs new, I pour a lot of thought into.

My own opinion is that that boxing evolution was done by the mid 1930's as far as teachable techniques go. You cannot teach someone to do what Ali did. After the one-off of the peekaboo style by Cus D'amatto, it was definitely complete.

The evolution now is not an evolution of teachable techniques brought to some whole new level. It is guys looking for "athletic" ways to fight. That is the hangover Ali left us with--thousands of less talented imitators who eschewed learning deep technique for the show business of fighting athletically.