Jack Dempsey or Sam Langford who do you rate as the greater fighter?

[Greatest1942]

i don't rate Harry Wills or Sam McVea as ATG Heavies, good yes but not ATGs

Well Sonny we seem to be in an eternal debate. But using ATG with McVEa might not be right okay I accept. But he was #30 in rings list and Willis was #16.Considering the rankings of Jacks opponents I think Sam fought better heavies. IF only Willis could fight Jack. Still Harry willis to me was great...but if you don't accept it fine...atleast he is near great. Not a champion but still in the top 20 speaks volumes aint it.Ask Sam

[sonnyboyx2]

Well Sonny we seem to be in an eternal debate. But using ATG with McVEa might not be right okay I accept. But he was #30 in rings list and Willis was #16.Considering the rankings of Jacks opponents I think Sam fought better heavies. IF only Willis could fight Jack. Still Harry willis to me was great...but if you don't accept it fine...atleast he is near great. Not a champion but still in the top 20 speaks volumes aint it.Ask Sam

i'll go along with you on that.

[Greatest1942]

i'll go along with you on that.

Here is an article for you mate from the period where Dempsey was thought to be invulnerable:-

Olean Evening Herald, New York 10-15-1923
Dempsey and the Old Timers…by Ed Hughes
“Who among the old timers” queries a reader, “would have been likely to whip Jack Dempsey? We all have our opinions, and the three in the writer’s mind who would have had a good chance are Jim Jeffries, Sam Langford and Bob Fitzsimmons. The writer believes that Jeffries in his prime would have proven too big, too tough, and too strong for even the great Dempsey. Langford and Fitzsimmons would have been almost even money choices. What do you think?

Take a brief comparison of Jeffries and Firpo to get a line on what Dempsey would have been up against the “California Grizzly.” Jeffries was not only as big as powerful as Firpo, but he could stand infinitely more punishment than the Andes Giant. This estimate is deduced from Jeffries showing against Bob Fitzsimmons. Few people are willing to admit that Dempsey hits a harder blow than did Fitzsimmons.

In two terrific battles Jeffries took the murderous wallops of the great Fitzsimmons without flinching. On each occasion he knocked out Fitz, and through all the torment that was dealt him Jeff never once went to the floor. In fact he was never once put down for the count while in his prime. It is doubtful that even Dempsey could have subjected Jeffries to such a beating as the boilermaker received from Fitzsimmons in their last battle on the coast. For seven rounds the wonderful Fitzsimmons hit Jeffries practically at will. The latter’s face was a ghastly sight, but Jeffries walked into the mauling steadily. When Fitz had punched himself ragged, actually smashing his hands in the effort, Jeff stepped in with the knockout.

An idea of how much damage Fitz inflicted was revealed after the fight. Jeff’s face was fearfully gashed in several places. His nose was quashed almost flat. Then stitches were taken over his right eye, eight over his left, six more under the right. Jeffries claimed that every tooth in his head had been loosened, that he was unable to eat solid food for weeks.

Jeffries was about twenty-five pounds heavier than Dempsey and a half inch taller. His reach was longer by 3-4 inches, while his 17 ½ inch neck was a full inch thicker than Dempsey’s. He was bigger in every way. He hit as crushing a blow with his left as Dempsey does, although not such a short one. Jeff too, became a first rate boxer, after the Fitzsimmons slaughter, actually outpointing the skillfull Corbett before sending in the knockout.

If Firpo could take seven knockdowns and then almost whip Dempsey it seems reasonable to suppose that Jeffries, a tougher man and an all around fighter, would have weathered Dempsey’s furious attack. And if Jeffries could have landed as Firpo did his right, Dempsey would have been staggered as he was with Firpo. Also it is a fair guess that Jeffries would not have permitted Dempsey to recover as he did with the slow moving South American.

Sam Langford in his prime might have knocked out Dempsey, although the chances are that Dempsey would have whipped the Boston tar baby. Langford had a left very like Dempsey’s of today. We remember him knocking Jim Barry with a typical clout – one that couldn’t have traveled more than six inches. In close, where Dempsey is most dangerous Sam also flourished.

Langford was about Dempsey’s weight, powerful built in every way, with arms as huge as a gorilla. However, Sam was 6 1/2 inches shorter than Dempsey, less speedy, and below Dempsey in power of resistance. Jack Johnson, for instance, put Langford down for a nine count, and Johnson was not considered a terrific hitter. In other words, it is doubtful whether Sam could have withstood the attack of Dempsey.

However, had they battled in the same day, and Dempsey fought him in the style he employed against Firpo, it might have resulted sensationally. And if Sam could have shot over that short right or left jolt of his Dempsey probably would have taken the count, just as Barry, Jim Flynn, John Lester Johnson, and Harry Wills did.

Fitzsimmons accounted by many the hardest hitter the ring ever knew would have had a good chance to flatten Dempsey because of his terrific smitting. However, Fitz would have been up against it physically with Dempsey. He was an inch and a quarter shorter than Dempsey and about thirty pounds lighter. Fitzsimmons was a comparatively open fighter, and he was frequently stunned in this battles. Jim Corbett, a light hitter, had him down and nearly out. Peter Maher hung him over the ropes, Fitzsimmons being saved from a knockout by the trickery of someone near the gong. Also Joe Choynski put him down and nearly out.

But Fitz, like Dempsey, was a terror in close. He could hit fearful blows from almost any angle. He knocked them out on the jaw or in the body. In a flying mix-up, such as characterized the first round of the recent Polo Grounds affair, he might have knocked Dempsey cold. Fitz was not a particularly clever boxer nor was he as fast as Dempsey. And he wasn’t built to take many of Dempsey’s lift to the jaw without feeling them. The man connecting the first solid rap would have won here. Dempsey’s speed would probably have named him the victor.

Jack Johnson was brilliantly clever, but lacked the aggressiveness and hard hitting to whip Dempsey. Dempsey would have “got” him in the end. The three who would have had a chance were Jeffries, Langford and Fitz.”

[SNVDoublePunch!]

As a heavyweight, Dempsey. P4P ...Langford and it's not even slightly close. World's apart.