Jack Dempsey or Sam Langford who do you rate as the greater fighter?

[Southpaw Great]

You are also a good poster and i am not wrong here... The topic question is "who do you rate as the greater fighter" and i say Jack Dempsey you say Sam Langford yet IMO its a no-contest.. Dempsey was an unbelievable fighting machine and Langford also was a very good fighter but not in the league of Dempsey..

The Topic then moves from who was the greater fighter` to Dempsey vs Wills and you claim Dempsey avoided Wills to the point where he got banned from New York.

Dempsey never ever avoided Harry Wills, infact Jack Dempsey signed to fight Wills on two occasions and both times the money offered was not put on the table by Wills promoters.. it has often been claimed that Dempsey avoided Wills which infact is a falsehood, Harry Wills was in his prime from 1914 - 1921 he was No1 contender for Jess Willards heavyweight title but Willard took 4yrs off after beating Jack Johnson for the title in 1915.. White promoters never again wanted a black fighter to fight and win the heavyweight title after all the antics of Jack Johnson who angered white America throughout his 7yrs reign.. Dempsey destroyed Willard for the title yet Harry Wills was 30yrs old and past his best and was 6yrs older than Dempsey with most in the press thinking that Wills was nothing more than an early KO win for Dempsey.. Tex Rickard who was 10 times the promoter than what Don King & Bob Arum are did not want a black fighter to ever hold the title again claiming the title "wouldn`t be worth a nickle" if a black fighter won it again.. the bottom line is that Jack Dempsey was afraid on no man.

He admitted he was scared of Langford do, and said he never wanted to fight him.

[sonnyboyx2]

But why did you say what was Langford's claim to fame? Like he was a fraud?

you have misinterpreted what i quoted, Dempsey was heavyweight champion of the world and regarded by most to be the greatest who ever lived until those who rated him so highly passed away in the 1960s, Gene Tunney who twice defeated Dempsey claimed right up to his death in 1978 that Dempsey was the greatest fighter of all time.

Sam Langford was a phenomenal fighter who if given his chance to fight for world titles from 140-175lbs would surely have been a world champion but to claim he could have beaten Dempsey is something i cannot comprehend.

one common opponent they both had was Fred Fulton who hospitalized Langford yet was nearly murderd in the opening round by Jack Dempsey... although it must be said Langford was past his best by some way.

[TheGreatA]

You are also a good poster and i am not wrong here... The topic question is "who do you rate as the greater fighter" and i say Jack Dempsey you say Sam Langford yet IMO its a no-contest.. Dempsey was an unbelievable fighting machine and Langford also was a very good fighter but not in the league of Dempsey..

The Topic then moves from who was the greater fighter` to Dempsey vs Wills and you claim Dempsey avoided Wills to the point where he got banned from New York.

Dempsey never ever avoided Harry Wills, infact Jack Dempsey signed to fight Wills on two occasions and both times the money offered was not put on the table by Wills promoters.. it has often been claimed that Dempsey avoided Wills which infact is a falsehood, Harry Wills was in his prime from 1914 - 1921 he was No1 contender for Jess Willards heavyweight title but Willard took 4yrs off after beating Jack Johnson for the title in 1915.. White promoters never again wanted a black fighter to fight and win the heavyweight title after all the antics of Jack Johnson who angered white America throughout his 7yrs reign.. Dempsey destroyed Willard for the title yet Harry Wills was 30yrs old and past his best and was 6yrs older than Dempsey with most in the press thinking that Wills was nothing more than an early KO win for Dempsey.. Tex Rickard who was 10 times the promoter than what Don King & Bob Arum are did not want a black fighter to ever hold the title again claiming the title "wouldn`t be worth a nickle" if a black fighter won it again.. the bottom line is that Jack Dempsey was afraid on no man.

I know everything about Dempsey and Wills. It is my opinion that Dempsey didn't push enough for the fight to be made. Let's be honest here, he wasn't very interested in fighting at all after becoming the champion, only occasionally defending his title (against Harry Greb left-overs) and getting involved in the Hollywood life. Dempsey's management made attempts to seem as if they were interested in a Wills fight, to appeal to the public that did want the fight, but never went all the way to make it happen. For a champion to not fight his top contender for 8 years is unforgivable.

Dempsey's manager also turned down the challenge of Joe Jeannette who was already standing in the ring with the gloves on, waiting to fight Dempsey. The only black opponent that Dempsey fought, John Lester Johnson, broke his ribs. It's not like there was an actual "color line" in place to prevent white fighters from fighting black fighters. It was self-imposed. Now I mostly blame Dempsey's management, but it's also true that you can't always hide behind your management. In the end, Dempsey just lacked the longevity of a Langford who consistently fought great opposition for decades. Dempsey's true prime run actually lasted only from 1918 to 1919. From then on he was never as motivated.

You seem to be rating Langford mostly as a heavyweight. He may or may not have beaten Dempsey but pound for pound he was surely greater. His heavyweight career was only the cusp of an already impressive career spanning weight divisions from lightweight up to heavyweight. He defeated the legendary lightweight champion Joe Gans at 135 lbs, defeated top lightweights Jack Blackburn, George McFadden & Dave Holly, fought Barbados Joe Walcott to a draw for the welterweight title, beat top middleweights Young Peter Jackson, Dixie Kid, KO'd future middleweight champ Tiger Flowers while near blind, carried middleweight champ Ketchel for 6 rounds, beat top light heavy Dixie Kid and KO'd light heavy champ O'Brien, fought future heavyweight champ Jack Johnson and beat top heavyweights Harry Wills, Joe Jeannette, Sam McVea and others. During his peak from 1908 to 1912 he only lost a single fight to Sam McVea.

His accomplishments are too numerous to list to be honest.

[pacmanny1]

Jack Dempsey or Sam Langford who do you rate as the greater fighter? also if they were to of met both in there primes who takes this fight?

Replying to ur sig. Julian jackson hit harder than every1 on ur list!

[sonnyboyx2]

I know everything about Dempsey and Wills. It is my opinion that Dempsey didn't push enough for the fight to be made. Let's be honest here, he wasn't very interested in fighting at all after becoming the champion, only occasionally defending his title (against Harry Greb left-overs) and getting involved in the Hollywood life. Dempsey's management made attempts to seem as if they were interested in a Wills fight, to appeal to the public that did want the fight, but never went all the way to make it happen. For a champion to not fight his top contender for 8 years is unforgivable.

Dempsey's manager also turned down the challenge of Joe Jeannette who was already standing in the ring with the gloves on, waiting to fight Dempsey. The only black opponent that Dempsey fought, John Lester Johnson, broke his ribs. It's not like there was an actual "color line" in place to prevent white fighters from fighting black fighters. It was self-imposed. Now I mostly blame Dempsey's management, but it's also true that you can't always hide behind your management. In the end, Dempsey just lacked the longevity of a Langford who consistently fought great opposition for decades. Dempsey's true prime run actually lasted only from 1918 to 1919. From then on he was never as motivated.

You seem to be rating Langford mostly as a heavyweight. He may or may not have beaten Dempsey but pound for pound he was surely greater. His heavyweight career was only the cusp of an already impressive career spanning weight divisions from lightweight up to heavyweight. He defeated the legendary lightweight champion Joe Gans at 135 lbs, defeated top lightweights Jack Blackburn, George McFadden & Dave Holly, fought Barbados Joe Walcott to a draw for the welterweight title, beat top middleweights Young Peter Jackson, Dixie Kid, KO'd future middleweight champ Tiger Flowers while near blind, carried middleweight champ Ketchel for 6 rounds, beat top light heavy Dixie Kid and KO'd light heavy champ O'Brien, fought future heavyweight champ Jack Johnson and beat top heavyweights Harry Wills, Joe Jeannette, Sam McVea and others. During his peak from 1908 to 1912 he only lost a single fight to Sam McVea.

His accomplishments are too numerous to list to be honest.

greater accomplishments - Sam Langford
greater fighter - Jack Dempsey

[TheGreatA]

greater accomplishments - Sam Langford
greater fighter - Jack Dempsey

I'll agree that Dempsey was the greater heavyweight but don't you think Langford would be a terror at 160 lbs?

[sonnyboyx2]

I'll agree that Dempsey was the greater heavyweight but don't you think Langford would be a terror at 160 lbs?

yes i think Langford would be a world champion at 160lbs in any era

[Chief2ndzOnly!]

Langford and it aint close imo.

I 100% co-sign this post you can /Thread right there.

[JackD]

He admitted he was scared of Langford do, and said he never wanted to fight him.

this guy knows his google i'm impressed.

jack dempsey said some strange things, or supposedly said some strange things. but the fact is that jess willard ko'd jack johnson in the 26th round. jack johnson beat langford in their only fight. and we all know jack dempsey beat jess willard worse than a modern fight would have allowed. gunboat smith defeated langford in 1 of their 2 fights and jack dempsey defeated smith both times they fought. the only question is the fireman guy langford beat that "knocked out" dempsey. this isn't on video and most believe dempsey threw the fight including gunboat smith who fought both dempsey and him and beat the fireman.

dempsey understood the importance of putting body weight into punches. i know that from the one book i read that he wrote (that i recommend). in that book he said he was not afraid of a 6'7 260lb willard. why would he seriously say someone as small as langford would "flatten" him? and langford was never outweighed as much as dempsey was with willard to my knowledge. people only praise langford because he was black. jack dempsey was the greatest from the greatest era of boxing bottom line.

[NChristo]

Got to love triangle theories.