Joe Louis Blamed D'Amato For Floyds Defeat To Ingo.

[Ivich]

From time to time I treat myself to some old Ring and BI ****zines from E Bay,reading one today an article by Dan Daniel caught my eye it was a ****zine dated just after Patterson was bombed out by Johansson,Louis stated that he blamed Cus for Floyd's defeat because by avoiding the good men Floyd was not give the chance to develop his own style and because of lack of enough top competition he wasn't prepared to deal with the Swede.Unusual for Louis to be so forthright ,do you think he was right?

[BKM-]

If that's what he said then he's quite correct, IMO. Giving Patterson a swarming, forward-only style with that glass chin of his may not have been the best idea. It worked out for him despite that, but stats don't lie. What was it, 27 knockdowns he suffered in total? If Louis himself was given that style he would have been decked a lot more and ran into more losses in his prime too. Physical limitations have to co-exist with the boxing style they're using.

[Willie Pep 229]

From time to time I treat myself to some old Ring and BI ****zines from E Bay,reading one today an article by Dan Daniel caught my eye it was a ****zine dated just after Patterson was bombed out by Johansson,Louis stated that he blamed Cus for Floyd's defeat because by avoiding the good men Floyd was not give the chance to develop his own style and because of lack of enough top competition he wasn't prepared to deal with the Swede.Unusual for Louis to be so forthright ,do you think he was right?

Did The Ring interview occurred before Patterson-Johansson II? Before Patterson's redemption.

The 'develop his own style' is an interesting critique considering the peek-a-boo style is synonymous with D'Amato.

It is as if he is criticizing D'Amato across the board as a trainer. I.e. D'Amato fighters had one style. (Not sure if that is a true statement but seems to be the CW.)

Can you post the article the way you did the Jeffries interview.? That was great.

P.S. Louis wasn't above hard words. He was, to my experiences watching interviews and guest appearances, never a bully or even boorish, but always held an air about him that he was to be respected. A serious man. I can't see Louis having an Ali-Cosell relationship with a reporter so the tone you're suggesting doesn't surprise me.

P.S.S. Also is it possible Louis is a touch guilty of the classic . . . "These new guys aren't learning the game right" cliche? I.e. is he suggesting Patterson was rushed to the top for quick cash?

[Ivich]

Did The Ring interview occurred before Patterson-Johansson II? Before Patterson's redemption.

The 'develop his own style' is an interesting critique considering the peek-a-boo style is synonymous with D'Amato.

It is as if he is criticizing D'Amato across the board as a trainer. I.e. D'Amato fighters had one style. (Not sure if that is a true statement but seems to be the CW.)

Can you post the article the way you did the Jeffries interview.? That was great.

P.S. Louis wasn't above hard words. He was, to my experiences watching interviews and guest appearances, never a bully or even boorish, but always held an air about him that he was to be respected. A serious man. I can't see Louis having an Ali-Cosell relationship with a reporter so the tone you're suggesting doesn't surprise me.

P.S.S. Also is it possible Louis is a touch guilty of the classic . . . "These new guys aren't learning the game right" cliche? I.e. is he suggesting Patterson was rushed to the top for quick cash?

","
It's the Nov/Dec1959 issue .The article is called Ingemar Marking Time. The sub heading is Louis Blasts D'Amato For Mishandling Floyd" which Daniel obviously agreed with because he says;
"Paterson has been the victim of mishandling by Cus D'Amato,this obvious fact has now been pointed up by former champ Joe Louis."
"Patterson has all the fistic tools with which to be a great champion,but he has not learned a thing since he turned pro and for this I blame D'Amato"said Louis.
" Patterson started out minus any style,and he still has none.Those long layoffs ,between fights and his failure to meet experienced and rated heavyweights hurt Floyd terribly .
Now about this Johansson.He hits hard.It's no disgrace to be knocked out by a guy like that.He can win any time he answers the bell.But Patterson was confused when he met the Swede.Floyd didnt seem to know what to do.he could not solve his problems because he had not met enough top flight fighters."Louis.

[Anthony342]

","
It's the Nov/Dec1959 issue .The article is called Ingemar Marking Time. The sub heading is Louis Blasts D'Amato For Mishandling Floyd" which Daniel obviously agreed with because he says;
"Paterson has been the victim of mishandling by Cus D'Amato,this obvious fact has now been pointed up by former champ Joe Louis."
"Patterson has all the fistic tools with which to be a great champion,but he has not learned a thing since he turned pro and for this I blame D'Amato"said Louis.
" Patterson started out minus any style,and he still has none.Those long layoffs ,between fights and his failure to meet experienced and rated heavyweights hurt Floyd terribly .
Now about this Johansson.He hits hard.It's no disgrace to be knocked out by a guy like that.He can win any time he answers the bell.But Patterson was confused when he met the Swede.Floyd didnt seem to know what to do.he could not solve his problems because he had not met enough top flight fighters."Louis.

Wow, interesting. Speaking of top flight fighters, could anything or anyone have prepared him later for Sonny Liston?

[BKM-]

Wow, interesting. Speaking of top flight fighters, could anything or anyone have prepared him later for Sonny Liston?

Paying off the mob.

[Anthony342]

Paying off the mob.

Dude, I wouldn't have put that past Cus. Surprised he didn't think of that.

[BKM-]

Dude, I wouldn't have put that past Cus. Surprised he didn't think of that.

Ha. Maybe he was connected too. He was Italian right?

[Willie Pep 229]

Paying off the mob.

I always like to think in that manner.

Can you buy, or buy off, the HW Champion of the World (even back then, certainly not today)? The title brings too much money for the gangsters not to want to control it.

Maybe if Liston had gone off as an overwhelming betting favorite, they could have bet heavy on Patterson and tanked Liston. Then given Liston a rematch with better betting odds and cleaned up on a Liston victory the other way around, next time around.

I think the reality was Liston as a slight favorite for fight #1 and a heavy favorite for fight #2.

I think Patterson was so popular, while everyone in the bizz knew Liston would blow him out in fight #1, public support for the Champion kept the odds too close for a fix to really pay off.

P.S. D'Amato was suspose to be anti-mob and that's why he cut Liston out from a shot at the title, and Patterson had to sever his relationship with D'Amato in order to take the first Liston fight. That fight should have taken place at least two maybe three years earlier. Some say D'Amato used the supposed mob connections for Liston as an excuse to duck him.

The IBC was busted up as a monopoly in 1958 but Carbo and Palmero don't go to prison until 1961.

The fight then takes place in 1962. Don't think it a coincidence; Pattersonn still had to break away from D'Amato to get the fight.

I realize I am over talking what was by you to be just a quick smirk. Sorry, but the mob and boxing is a topic I find most interesting.

[QueensburyRules]

I always like to think in that manner.

Can you buy, or buy off, the HW Champion of the World (even back then, certainly not today)? The title brings too much money for the gangsters not to want to control it.

Maybe if Liston had gone off as an overwhelming betting favorite, they could have bet heavy on Patterson and tanked Liston. Then given Liston a rematch with better betting odds and cleaned up on a Liston victory the other way around, next time around.

I think the reality was Liston as a slight favorite for fight #1 and a heavy favorite for fight #2.

I think Patterson was so popular, while everyone in the bizz knew Liston would blow him out in fight #1, public support for the Champion kept the odds too close for a fix to really pay off.

P.S. D'Amato was suspose to be anti-mob and that's why he cut Liston out from a shot at the title, and Patterson had to sever his relationship with D'Amato in order to take the first Liston fight. That fight should have taken place at least two maybe three years earlier. Some say D'Amato used the supposed mob connections for Liston as an excuse to duck him.

The IBC was busted up as a monopoly in 1958 but Carbo and Palmero don't go to prison until 1961.

The fight then takes place in 1962. Don't think it a coincidence; Pattersonn still had to break away from D'Amato to get the fight.

I realize I am over talking what was by you to be just a quick smirk. Sorry, but the mob and boxing is a topic I find most interesting.

- - Floyd manned up like a true fighter. He ended up fighting just about everyone and has one of the better comebacks after devastating defeats ever.