It's 1920, Jack's in training to fight Miske in a few months. He had some other boys he was working with but needed someone who could push him slickly. He had boys for power and toughness and needed some helpers to get his reflexes and speed up.
First they bring in Panama Joe. Joe would enter the sparring ring with Jack just after Tate was finished. So a fresh Panama vs a warmed up Jack, sparring though. Panama does very well and Jack-n-Team are very happy with him so they keep him on board for the remainder of the training camp. That's about 40 pounds difference between the fighters, guessimate from their fight weights. I dunno Jack's walk around or Joes, but, in a training camp I assume both men are fit. Later Joe would try, like everyone else, to get a Dempsey fight, but, Bill Breenan was chosen instead. I don't think Bill and Joe ever fought.
Nearer toward the end Harry was brought in as well. Panama and Greb, together, both, seems massive overkill for Miske, but you gotta give Jack credit here. The only other slick man at the time on that level was Norfolk. He literally gathered the best slick men of his era to improve his slickness even though he was just fighting Miske. Massively prepped and I think pointing that out is worth a little aside to the point.
Panama and Greb, being smaller men, were shifted days so that Dempsey didn't put too much damage on one or the other and always had a fresh, lightning fast, hard hitting, slick boxer to train with.
Greb, not much liking how he has displayed with Jack would approach Panama for a sparring session. Greb seems to have wanted to make a name for himself in the camp and was thwarted by Dempsey himself. Dempsey, having worked with Panama a bit longer, had given Panama more chances to pull something off and look good for the boys in camp, which Panama had, but Greb hadn't yet.
This is a fresh Greb vs a Dempsey who went rounds with Tate first and holding back because he doesn't want to KO Greb and ruin his own training. If that doesn't say Dempsey would have battered the kid in a proper fight then sparring means **** all to proper fights period. That's some strong evidence Jack simply hit too hard for Greb and though may not have been as slick he was slick enough to put that power on Greb. Something Tunney and Norfolk, the Greb beaters, lacked. I wouldn't say Tunney or Norfolk hit like kittens but by all accounts Jack should be that next level in power. He's either a massive puncher, or, the entire era of folks who watched him all agreed to lie about it. Obviously one should lean former.
That's it though. I reckon Dempsey over Greb solely because Greb got frustrated with Dempsey and the training team because Dempsey didn't let him look good where as Panama had plenty of situations he looked good in.
Panama, of course, agrees to Greb's request and the boys set to. Both are fresh. It was apparently a great showing by both men but got a bit too heated and flirting with one hurting the other at some point so the team put a rest to it and called it even. It is the only encounter between the two. Panama did prep Norfolk though.
Panama "draws" Greb, Panama has "wins" over Dempsey. Dempsey "wins" over Greb and Panama. Greb, the man you'd think would look best here, walks away with a "draw" to Panama and nothing else. It's rather similar to the Battling Gahee story. Gahee thought he'd go into camp and shake things up. Gahee got battered and became scared then was cut, useless to the champion Dempsey. Greb did suffer as bad, but, Greb you'd except more from, no? By all accounts the great Harry Greb was merely serviceable for Dempsey's needs. Not even close to more than what Jack bargained for. Harry ****in' Greb though...ya get me?
I got most of this from Sundowners and a little from just google searchin'.
First they bring in Panama Joe. Joe would enter the sparring ring with Jack just after Tate was finished. So a fresh Panama vs a warmed up Jack, sparring though. Panama does very well and Jack-n-Team are very happy with him so they keep him on board for the remainder of the training camp. That's about 40 pounds difference between the fighters, guessimate from their fight weights. I dunno Jack's walk around or Joes, but, in a training camp I assume both men are fit. Later Joe would try, like everyone else, to get a Dempsey fight, but, Bill Breenan was chosen instead. I don't think Bill and Joe ever fought.
Nearer toward the end Harry was brought in as well. Panama and Greb, together, both, seems massive overkill for Miske, but you gotta give Jack credit here. The only other slick man at the time on that level was Norfolk. He literally gathered the best slick men of his era to improve his slickness even though he was just fighting Miske. Massively prepped and I think pointing that out is worth a little aside to the point.
Panama and Greb, being smaller men, were shifted days so that Dempsey didn't put too much damage on one or the other and always had a fresh, lightning fast, hard hitting, slick boxer to train with.
Greb, not much liking how he has displayed with Jack would approach Panama for a sparring session. Greb seems to have wanted to make a name for himself in the camp and was thwarted by Dempsey himself. Dempsey, having worked with Panama a bit longer, had given Panama more chances to pull something off and look good for the boys in camp, which Panama had, but Greb hadn't yet.
This is a fresh Greb vs a Dempsey who went rounds with Tate first and holding back because he doesn't want to KO Greb and ruin his own training. If that doesn't say Dempsey would have battered the kid in a proper fight then sparring means **** all to proper fights period. That's some strong evidence Jack simply hit too hard for Greb and though may not have been as slick he was slick enough to put that power on Greb. Something Tunney and Norfolk, the Greb beaters, lacked. I wouldn't say Tunney or Norfolk hit like kittens but by all accounts Jack should be that next level in power. He's either a massive puncher, or, the entire era of folks who watched him all agreed to lie about it. Obviously one should lean former.
That's it though. I reckon Dempsey over Greb solely because Greb got frustrated with Dempsey and the training team because Dempsey didn't let him look good where as Panama had plenty of situations he looked good in.
Panama, of course, agrees to Greb's request and the boys set to. Both are fresh. It was apparently a great showing by both men but got a bit too heated and flirting with one hurting the other at some point so the team put a rest to it and called it even. It is the only encounter between the two. Panama did prep Norfolk though.
Panama "draws" Greb, Panama has "wins" over Dempsey. Dempsey "wins" over Greb and Panama. Greb, the man you'd think would look best here, walks away with a "draw" to Panama and nothing else. It's rather similar to the Battling Gahee story. Gahee thought he'd go into camp and shake things up. Gahee got battered and became scared then was cut, useless to the champion Dempsey. Greb did suffer as bad, but, Greb you'd except more from, no? By all accounts the great Harry Greb was merely serviceable for Dempsey's needs. Not even close to more than what Jack bargained for. Harry ****in' Greb though...ya get me?
I got most of this from Sundowners and a little from just google searchin'.
billeau2
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