how would joe louis do against ali's best comp?

[AntonTheMeh]

how would he have done vs Frazier, Liston, foreman, Patterson, Norton, Spinks, and Holmes?

i think he ko's frazier,patterson,Spinks, and Norton,
and he'd lose to foreman,Liston,and Holmes.
i think foreman ko's him; just too big and strong;
and he'd lose a SD to Liston and a UD to Holmes.

[JAB5239]

how would he have done vs Frazier, Liston, foreman, Patterson, Norton, Spinks, and Holmes?

i think he ko's frazier,patterson,Spinks, and Norton,
and he'd lose to foreman,Liston,and Holmes.
i think foreman ko's him; just too big and strong;
and he'd lose a SD to Liston and a UD to Holmes.

I think he would stop Frazier after tasting the canvas. He would stop Liston late, Sonny was to pedictable in my opinion. I give him a better shot than most against Foreman. Joe was pinpoint accurate with his bombs, but it would still favor George overall. He destroys Patterson, Norton and Spinks in highlight reel fashion and gets a tough, hard fought decision over Holmes. Jmo.

[TheGreatA]

I would take Spinks out of the list and add Quarry, Lyle, Shavers, Young, all good fighters who could possibly trouble Joe Louis. Leon would be destroyed in about a round or two.

I give Louis a good chance against all of them, Foreman would be favoured against Louis in my opinion but Joe was the king of rematches. Foreman had many flaws which a smart boxer-puncher like Louis could exploit.


Louis picks apart the crude but powerful Max Baer

Holmes was at the top of his game when he fought Ali while Ali obviously was not, that Holmes would have a very good chance against Louis too.
If Louis was as shot a fighter as Ali was (imagine the Louis of the Rocky Marciano fight), he would lose as one-sidedly as Ali did.

The Liston who fought Ali would lose to Louis IMO but Liston against Louis, both at their best would be close to an even fight. Liston may not have been as great a boxer but he could make up for it with his size, reach, strength and toughness.

Many thought he was the second coming of Joe Louis at the time. Now Liston is almost forgotten.

Louis admitted that he didn't like fighting pressure fighters, the best pressure fighter of his day Arturo Godoy troubled him a lot (Louis won a SD in their first bout) but Louis completely destroyed Godoy in their rematch with jabs, uppercuts and hooks in combinations which Godoy couldn't deal with.

Frazier was better than Godoy but they were somewhat similar in style although Godoy clinched unlike Joe and threw fewer punches with lesser punching power.


Louis vs Godoy II

Norton was trouble for boxers like Ali and Holmes, he had great conditioning and always kept coming but IMO he could never fight too well backing up. Louis' best chance would be to push Norton back relentlessly like he did to Max Schmeling in their rematch and go for an early knockout.

Louis definitely had the tools to do it but he often boxed a little more conservatively.


Louis vs Schmeling II

[StarshipTrooper]

I would take Spinks out of the list and add Quarry, Lyle, Shavers, Young, all good fighters who could possibly trouble Joe Louis. Leon would be destroyed in about a round or two.

I give Louis a good chance against all of them, Foreman would be favoured against Louis in my opinion but Joe was the king of rematches. Foreman had many flaws which a smart boxer-puncher like Louis could exploit.


Louis picks apart the crude but powerful Max Baer

Holmes was at the top of his game when he fought Ali while Ali obviously was not, that Holmes would have a very good chance against Louis too.
If Louis was as shot a fighter as Ali was (imagine the Louis of the Rocky Marciano fight), he would lose as one-sidedly as Ali did.

The Liston who fought Ali would lose to Louis IMO but Liston against Louis, both at their best would be close to an even fight. Liston may not have been as great a boxer but he could make up for it with his size, reach, strength and toughness.
Many thought he was the second coming of Joe Louis at the time. Now Liston is almost forgotten.

Louis admitted that he didn't like fighting pressure fighters, the best pressure fighter of his day Arturo Godoy troubled him a lot (Louis won a SD in their first bout) but Louis completely destroyed Godoy in their rematch with jabs, uppercuts and hooks in combinations which Godoy couldn't deal with.

Frazier was better than Godoy but they were somewhat similar in style although Godoy clinched unlike Joe and threw fewer punches with lesser punching power.


Louis vs Godoy II

Norton was trouble for boxers like Ali and Holmes, he had great conditioning and always kept coming but IMO he could never fight too well backing up. Louis' best chance would be to push Norton back relentlessly like he did to Max Schmeling in their rematch and go for an early knockout.

Louis definitely had the tools to do it but he often boxed a little more conservatively.


Louis vs Schmeling II

Great analysis! This is Boxing Scene at it best!

Poet

[AntonTheMeh]

I would take Spinks out of the list and add Quarry, Lyle, Shavers, Young, all good fighters who could possibly trouble Joe Louis. Leon would be destroyed in about a round or two.

I give Louis a good chance against all of them, Foreman would be favoured against Louis in my opinion but Joe was the king of rematches. Foreman had many flaws which a smart boxer-puncher like Louis could exploit.


Louis picks apart the crude but powerful Max Baer

Holmes was at the top of his game when he fought Ali while Ali obviously was not, that Holmes would have a very good chance against Louis too.
If Louis was as shot a fighter as Ali was (imagine the Louis of the Rocky Marciano fight), he would lose as one-sidedly as Ali did.

The Liston who fought Ali would lose to Louis IMO but Liston against Louis, both at their best would be close to an even fight. Liston may not have been as great a boxer but he could make up for it with his size, reach, strength and toughness.

Many thought he was the second coming of Joe Louis at the time. Now Liston is almost forgotten.

Louis admitted that he didn't like fighting pressure fighters, the best pressure fighter of his day Arturo Godoy troubled him a lot (Louis won a SD in their first bout) but Louis completely destroyed Godoy in their rematch with jabs, uppercuts and hooks in combinations which Godoy couldn't deal with.

Frazier was better than Godoy but they were somewhat similar in style although Godoy clinched unlike Joe and threw fewer punches with lesser punching power.


Louis vs Godoy II

Norton was trouble for boxers like Ali and Holmes, he had great conditioning and always kept coming but IMO he could never fight too well backing up. Louis' best chance would be to push Norton back relentlessly like he did to Max Schmeling in their rematch and go for an early knockout.

Louis definitely had the tools to do it but he often boxed a little more conservatively.


Louis vs Schmeling II

good analysis. that godoy fight is an upload of mine i got from downloading
one of poets uploads.
thanks poet.
on another subject,
anybody else think that the ali frazier rivalry was alot like the dempsey tunney rivalry?
i was watching dempsey tunney one and two and i thought that frazier was almost a carbon copy of dempsey, his bob and weave was quite similar.and tunney was an exceptional out fighter; ali reminded me of him too.

[LondonRingRules]

how would he have done vs Frazier, Liston, foreman, Patterson, Norton, Spinks, and Holmes?

** Better question would be how Ali would fare coming up against Louis' comp.

Pretty poor since he only arguably makes it past Jones and Cooper where Louis was demolishing Carnera and Baer, two all time great physical specimans. Would have been a long fight back in a 40-50 fight era before a fighter gets a title shot. Ali was fairly well washed up by 50 fights, so his title opportunities are more limited.

As to your question, you must of confused Michael with Leon as there is only one HOF great Spinks.

As to taking Joe at a similar age against the aforementioned fighters minus Spinks, Joe Frazier KOs Joe. Bad style match up for him. Joe could beat the older past it, poorly trained diving version of Liston Ali got, but it'd be shaky if Liston caught him with that left hook.

Foreman, though poorly trained for Ali, would flatten Joe in another bad style matchup. It took an alltime great chin and body to endure what Ali did that night, and Joe not in the same class in those attributes. Some say Joe would counter Foreman's wild swings which is true to a point, but even a missed Foreman swing knocks him off balance and keeps him from setting up and Foreman was a master at adjusting his timing to make up for a lack of speed.

Patterson of the slipped disc would be put out much earlier than Ali did. Norton would be a war and prove to be as awkward and strong to Joe as he was to Ali. I favor Norton, but with his chin, could be later on Joe times him perfectly. A 50/50 fight overall.

Holmes? The past it Joe that was KOed by Rocky would last much longer against Big Lar and have more moments, maybe dropping him at some point. Probably lasts the distance and drops a close decision in a fight resembling the Charles fight.

[Silencers]

I think Louis would have had big trouble with Frazier, Foreman and Holmes. Quarry, Shavers, Patterson and Liston would have given him very tough fights as well.

[Miburo]

I don't see him having much chance against Foreman or Holmes. Frazier more of a toss-up. Recall that Louis, though large for his era, was not particularly large HW.

[TheGreatA]

I don't see him having much chance against Foreman or Holmes. Frazier more of a toss-up. Recall that Louis, though large for his era, was not particularly large HW.

Louis had some of his best performances at 205 lbs though. He was around 6'2.

Holmes was 6'3-6'4, his best fighting weight around 210 lbs IMO.

Foreman was bigger at 6'4, 215+ lbs. I saw some pictures of old Louis next to Foreman and they were surprisingly similar in size.

Big George and maybe Ron Lyle are the only Ali's top opponents who had significant size advantages over Louis. The others were around his height and weight.


Joe Louis working the 6'5, 255 lb punching bag Abe Simon. Louis was 208 lbs for this fight.

I would imagine the Larry Holmes from the Ken Norton fight (one of his best performances despite the close decision win) against this Joe Louis, both the same weight and age.
Holmes could still take it of course but size wouldn't be a factor.

[Smokin'J]