Frazier reminds me of La Motta

[War Room]

I remember him fighting when I was a kid and he's pretty much known for giving Ali his first loss. Quarry, Ellis, Bonavena, Foster, these guys had loads of losses when he fought them and he fought a few of them a few times. Never fought Lyle or Norton, Foreman turned him into a leprechaun. Not a fan of Frazier as a fighter tbh.

La Motta same thing, mainly known for giving Robinson his first loss and honestly, his record is kind of similar to Fraziers, beat up the same guys a lot. Maybe 2 notable names on there.

I'm not saying Frazier and La Motta were terrible fighters, just they're kind of similar in a way ---> B+ level fighters I think get overclassed as A level fighters.

What do you guys think?

[Marchegiano]

If they're B+ then A class must be a handful of guys.

Beings second rate in an era doesn't equate to second rate all time.

[War Room]

If they're B+ then A class must be a handful of guys.

Beings second rate in an era doesn't equate to second rate all time.

I think most of the 80's and 90's era stops Frazier pretty easily. Tommy Morrison would beat thee brakes off Frazier.

[QueensburyRules]

- -Romper Room level mayhem!!!

[Marchegiano]

I think most of the 80's and 90's era stops Frazier pretty easily. Tommy Morrison would beat thee brakes off Frazier.

Underplaying Frazier's pace. Morrison tires out.

[War Room]

Underplaying Frazier's pace. Morrison tires out.

He spent most of his career ay 205, he's too small. Bert Cooper was a extremely similar style, weighed more, and was riddled with losses. I'll take Cooper to stop Frazier. I think you got this nostalgia thing going on man.

[Marchegiano]

He spent most of his career ay 205, he's too small. Bert Cooper was a extremely similar style, weighed more, and was riddled with losses. I'll take Cooper to stop Frazier. I think you got this nostalgia thing going on man.

I can't be nostalgic for an era before my birth bud. You meant bias for olden ****ers?

Not so much that he's older as much as I don't put as much value into weight as you do. There's 686BC-300-ish AD of open weight history and again from 1722-1880's there's more open weight history. In none of these histories does boxing actually favor huge men or small men. It's mostly average sized dudes who beat up everyone until weight divisions became a standard.

For two reasons, none of these eras had time limits. It might sound counter intuitive but a fight to the finish favors the average sized man. The other reason is obviously as you go back in time you go back in infrastructure. There's not even much point looking for a modern sized HW in ancient eras because they simply don't have the infrastructure to support the health issues that come with being massive. The bare knuckle era sees a few bigger than average sized HW champions, but very few and these days those guys would be considered small HWs.

Then you get into eras with defined finishes and as the duration gets lessened over time the size of viable HWs grows.

They did call Bean the King of the Four Rounder.

And so, what you have here is a fella who can do a hard paced 15 rounder being asked to task a fella who struggles to do a well paced 12. I think Frazier lights Morrison up, often, and takes him out in the latter half of a 12 round fight.

[War Room]

I can't be nostalgic for an era before my birth bud. You meant bias for olden ****ers?

Not so much that he's older as much as I don't put as much value into weight as you do. There's 686BC-300-ish AD of open weight history and again from 1722-1880's there's more open weight history. In none of these histories does boxing actually favor huge men or small men. It's mostly average sized dudes who beat up everyone until weight divisions became a standard.

For two reasons, none of these eras had time limits. It might sound counter intuitive but a fight to the finish favors the average sized man. The other reason is obviously as you go back in time you go back in infrastructure. There's not even much point looking for a modern sized HW in ancient eras because they simply don't have the infrastructure to support the health issues that come with being massive. The bare knuckle era sees a few bigger than average sized HW champions, but very few and these days those guys would be considered small HWs.

Then you get into eras with defined finishes and as the duration gets lessened over time the size of viable HWs grows.

They did call Bean the King of the Four Rounder.

And so, what you have here is a fella who can do a hard paced 15 rounder being asked to task a fella who struggles to do a well paced 12. I think Frazier lights Morrison up, often, and takes him out in the latter half of a 12 round fight.

Of course you can, do you even know what nostalgia means? Literally: a sentimental longing or wistful affection for the past. Look at your name, your stance here, some deductive reasoning, and yes ---> nostalgia is a very fitting word. His work rate, other guys get tired. Come on man, that's like zero substance. So yes, nostalgia.

Of course weight matters, Tyson Fury would destroy Roy Jones when Jones was jr middle or midddle. What does ancient history have to do with that? You're talking about times when boxing training didn't even really exist. And I'm pretty sure Tyson Fury would destroy Frazier and his lucky charms.

Jones was 200 on the dot and couldn't even hurt Ruiz, a 205 Frazier isn't any different.

Frazier was a arm puncher that lunged in, the guy had 32 wins in an era where fighters had tons of fights. I mean look at this mess --->

Holmes, Shavers, Norton, Weaver, Cobb, Witherspoon, Tyson, Golota, Mercer, Cooper, Morrison, Ruddock, Holyfield, Bowe, Lennox, Byrd, Pinklon, Bonecrusher, Toney, Moorer, Stewart, Dokes, Botha, Bruno, Tucker, all those guys whoop on little 205 pound Frazier. He wasn't that good.

[Marchegiano]

Of course you can, do you even know what nostalgia means? Literally: a sentimental longing or wistful affection for the past. Look at your name, your stance here, some deductive reasoning, and yes ---> nostalgia is a very fitting word. His work rate, other guys get tired. Come on man, that's like zero substance. So yes, nostalgia.

Of course weight matters, Tyson Fury would destroy Roy Jones when Jones was jr middle or midddle. What does ancient history have to do with that? You're talking about times when boxing training didn't even really exist. And I'm pretty sure Tyson Fury would destroy Frazier and his lucky charms.

Jones was 200 on the dot and couldn't even hurt Ruiz, a 205 Frazier isn't any different.

Frazier was a arm puncher that lunged in, the guy had 32 wins in an era where fighters had tons of fights. I mean look at this mess --->

Holmes, Shavers, Norton, Weaver, Cobb, Witherspoon, Tyson, Golota, Mercer, Cooper, Morrison, Ruddock, Holyfield, Bowe, Lennox, Byrd, Pinklon, Bonecrusher, Toney, Moorer, Stewart, Dokes, Botha, Bruno, Tucker, all those guys whoop on little 205 pound Frazier. He wasn't that good.

Do you know what semantics means?

[cfang]

Frazier was an incredible heavy. In fact, with a few things going his way, he could have won all three fights against Ali. aWhere would that leave him in a historical sense? the first fight he won well, the second, Ali did better only cos of his illegal pushing down on joes neck inside and the third, ali was about to give up and collapsed right after futch threw in the towel.

Don't get me wrong, Ali was greater and what happened happened but joe was very close to ali and in fact only lost to two fighters, ali and foreman.

Prime frazier beats norton, lyle and all the top heavys of his era apart from ali and foreman.

Offcwhat he also had was endless stamina, speed and unbelievable courage. Any fight hes in that turns into a test of these things, hes potentially going to win,

Hes a top ten all time heavy and would beat many other great heavys. He's light years above some of the fighters mentioned.