Gracies?

[Left Hook Tua]

I know there's a lot of hate for the Gracies from mma fans.

I know people think they're one dimensional and mma has passed them by.

But am I the only one rooting for the Gracies to make it big again in mma?

They need to get muay thai and boxing coaches and need to improve their wrestling and takedowns but as good as they are on the ground they could be quite formidable with better crosstraining.

I'm not talking about Royce , Rickson , Renzo , etc. they're all in the 40's now.

The 3rd generation is in their early 20's and unlike the older generation , they're pretty muscular and athletic. Roger Gracie is 6'4 230 , all 4 of Rorion's sons are about 6'1 or taller (Ralek just had his 2nd fight in Dream 4 and looked awkward standing up but of course groundgame was great) , Kron , Rickson's son is a good size for welterweight and is only 19.

Thoughts?

[Left Hook Tua]

This is Kron Gracie. Rickson Gracie's son.







He's about 5'9 - 5'10 and around 175 lbs.

He's won Middleweight (181 lbs. and under) and Absolute (No weight class) at Brown Belt at the Pan American and Mundials (World Championships)

He recently loss at the Mundials to the eventual World Champion Sergio Moraes at Black Belt but it was his first tournament after getting promoted to Black Belt and it was at the World Championships.

He'll recover from the loss. He just turned 19 and was just promoted to Black Belt and he was up against grown men who have been competing for years and much stronger.

The last time Kron lost was at Purple Belt years ago and he went on to win 55-60 consecutive Tournament matches with submission.

[Left Hook Tua]

This is Ralek Gracie. One of Rorion's (founder of the UFC and Royce Gracie's older brother) 4 sons. This is only his 2nd pro mma fight. It was at Dream 4 over the weekend in Japan. Dream is a great new org and probably gonna be the new Pride.



He's a good size. 6'2 205 lbs. He needs to work on his standup and wrestling but you can tell the ground game is world class. Not bad for only his 2nd fight. His opponent was 7-1 i believe and had koe'd 5-6 of his last opponents and was a Sambo expert from Russia.

Ralek is only 22 and his brothers are as big as he is. Him and his brothers are real big and muscular and athletic unlike the 2nd generation Gracies who are in their 40's now.

[Left Hook Tua]

This is Roger Gracie from Gracie Barra U.K.



He's huge at 6'4 230. He has dominated at Heavyweight , Super Heavyweight and Absolute (No Weight Class) at the Pan Americans and Mundials. He also submitted all 8 of his opponents at Abu Dhabi ADCC No Gi Submission Wrestling Championships.

He's 2-0 in mma so far i think. Submitting both Yuki Kondo (former Light Heavyweight and Open Weight Pancrase champion) and Ron Waterman.

[Spare Moody]

i would love to see the Gracies get with the times and shut their mouths.

[Left Hook Tua]

i would love to see the Gracies get with the times and shut their mouths.

all fighters talk.

i think they have just as much right as any.

if ken shamrock can run his mouth the guy 50 lb. less than him and choked him out can also.

[Spare Moody]

i'm not talkin about fighters talkin **** to hype up fights. i'm talkin about these guys talkin **** on nearly every other fighter when they themselves rarely compete. but even when they do they cry about their losses, create all sorts of controversy, insist on ridiculous paychecks and demand that rules be changed to favor their style. no other fighters do this anywhere NEAR as often and consistent as that family.

they contributed greatly to MMA by putting the most effective fighting style on the map. no respect should be taken away from that. but since then they've been the poorest sports in the sport. now they practically represent everything that SHOULDN'T be displayed for any sport. nearly every talented fighter has taken a gracious and humble attitude. the Gracies are arrogent, smug, disrespectful, and generally show poor taste. there's no reason for that.

[res]

i'm not talkin about fighters talkin **** to hype up fights. i'm talkin about these guys talkin **** on nearly every other fighter when they themselves rarely compete. but even when they do they cry about their losses, create all sorts of controversy, insist on ridiculous paychecks and demand that rules be changed to favor their style. no other fighters do this anywhere NEAR as often and consistent as that family.

they contributed greatly to MMA by putting the most effective fighting style on the map. no respect should be taken away from that. but since then they've been the poorest sports in the sport. now they practically represent everything that SHOULDN'T be displayed for any sport. nearly every talented fighter has taken a gracious and humble attitude. the Gracies are arrogent, smug, disrespectful, and generally show poor taste. there's no reason for that.

Well they not only put an effective style on the map, they started the MMA sport (with promotional help ofcourse ). I think what they are complaining about is that their reality based competition (no rules) is no longer what it was when they introduced it. It is not that they want the rules changed, it is that the rules have been changed from what they originally were. The intent ofcourse was to answer the question of which style worked best when you had merely two men and no other limiting factors. Imagine if a boxer told an MMA fighter that boxers were the best type of combat athlete and that he would fight him to prove it, but that he wasn't going to fight him using MMA rules because they favored the MMA fighter, and that he was going to fight him with boxing rules. Now how could we resolve this argument over rules? Simple, we would make it so there were no rules and it didn't favor anyone. Now if the MMA fighter came out triumphant we couldn't then say that the "no rules" scenario were infact rules that favored the MMA fighter because of the fact that he won, that would be ridiculous. The Gracies challenged the other Martial Artists of the world in a no rules competition that those other fighters thought they were going to win. How does the fact that the Gracies won all of sudden turn a no rules scenario ito a Gracie favoring scenario? Was it a Gracie favoring scenario before they won? It seems that what they proved is what they set out to prove: That their art was the most effective in a fight between two men with no artificial restraints or limitations.

Now they only proved this for their time, MMA has changed and it would be interesting to see Gracies against top modern MMA fighters with no rules. One of the problems is that modern MMA fighters risk loosing their liscences by participating in fights that violate the rules of the athletic commissions that certify them. Anyway, I don't see what simply complaining it about it is going to accomplish on their part.

The new Gracies may do o.k. but they no longer face a style of competition that will allow them to be exceptional.

[Left Hook Tua]

i'm not talkin about fighters talkin **** to hype up fights. i'm talkin about these guys talkin **** on nearly every other fighter when they themselves rarely compete. but even when they do they cry about their losses, create all sorts of controversy, insist on ridiculous paychecks and demand that rules be changed to favor their style. no other fighters do this anywhere NEAR as often and consistent as that family.

they contributed greatly to MMA by putting the most effective fighting style on the map. no respect should be taken away from that. but since then they've been the poorest sports in the sport. now they practically represent everything that SHOULDN'T be displayed for any sport. nearly every talented fighter has taken a gracious and humble attitude. the Gracies are arrogent, smug, disrespectful, and generally show poor taste. there's no reason for that.

those guys that talk crap are 40-50 yrs. old.

how about when old , retired boxers criticize boxers in this era? everyone does it. everybody looks back to the "good old days" in everything in life. look at how arrogant frank and ken shamrock are. are they sportsmen?

they were great fighters in their time. every great fighter is arrogant. look at the fighters now that are great. b.j. penn humble? it's not about personality besides it's just promotion for themselves , the fights and their style and dojos.

you're talking about the old gracies. rickson is 50. royce is 43. i'm talking about the young ones that might possibly be coming up.

as far as the rules they want. the rules changed on them. the rules they want are the rules that was originally in the ufc. besides it's just royce anyway. rickson and renzo never had problems fighting rounds. it's just royce can't compete with the new rules because of his style. look up shamrock-royce 2. ken just popshot and laid on top of royce because he knows royce cant push him off and can't submit him if he just lays there.