Better Actor: Norton vs. Spacey

[PBDS]

Both are great actors but Norton is better. Penn is way overated IMO.

[Boxerdog]

By the way. Sean Penn is right there with these two guys. The poster who mentioned Sweet and Lowdown has got my vote. This is Woody Allen's best effort in a decade, partly because of casting Penn as the main character. In parts, I thought he was acually playing that guitar.

I love Sean Penn...thought his role in "Carlito's Way" was one of the most amazing jobs of disapearing inside a character I've ever seen. That being said, I have to voice my serious disapointment with the way he approached the part in "Sweet and Lowdown". He obviously made NO effort to study any guitarists.
If you thought he was "actually playing that guitar" you obviously are easily fooled. I'm not saying he should have learned to play like Wes Montgomery but he didn't make ANY effort to learn about hand placement. DeNiro learned some saxaphone for a role, Richard Gere learned some *****et for "The Cotton Club". Penn's lack of interest and commitment pissed me off.

[Moon]

I have to voice my serious disapointment with the way he approached the part in "Sweet and Lowdown". He obviously made NO effort to study any guitarists.

Seems the people who nominated both Penn and Samantha for Oscars didn't have that same problem. In reality Penn probably emmersed himself in studying Emmett Ray, who was, as you know, a notable guitarist. In preparing for his role as Ray, I'm sure made some effort to study.

If you thought he was "actually playing that guitar" you obviously are easily fooled .... he didn't make ANY effort to learn about hand placement. Penn's lack of interest and commitment pissed me off.

Obviously you are a guitar player, like myself. So, we're both not easily fooled. I stand by what I said, especially when you cosider what "guitar" playing normally looks like when an actor is handed the instrument for the first time.

Penn's body movement when "playing" guitar looked very much like a guitarist. He was obviously coached and was a good student, like he is with all his roles. Take a look again at Penn's entire body next time, not just his fingers. He LOOKS like a guitar player, that's why he pulls it off so well.

About the fingers, which you seem to have locked-onto, he did a hell of job, for a guy who doesn't play any instrument and has no musical training. There's times when he's a bit flat ********, but that's about all. Other than that, he's doing finger rolls, minor seventh chords, double pump strumming, and the occasional nervous tuning. That looks good to me.

[Moon]

BOXERDOG .... dissing Sean Penn, while at the same time giving props to Richard Gere, looks a bit su****ious.

[Run]

Way too tough to call for me. I like them both. Slight edge goes to Spacey IMO.

Oldman mops the floor with them both. Watch Romeo is Bleeding. That movie is ****ing pimp as ****ing ****. Better director as well (not that the two in discussion are directors). Just view "Nil By Mouth", one of the most underrated independant films I have ever seen. You can not get any more pimp, than what he portrayed in his small role in "True Romance" either.

He was a white guy, playing a black pimp. That is ****ing ruthless.



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[m00ks]

Spacey. Although both are good actors, I find he's more flexible in terms of roles than Norton

[oldgringo]

Way too tough to call for me. I like them both. Slight edge goes to Spacey IMO.

Oldman mops the floor with them both. Watch Romeo is Bleeding. That movie is ****ing pimp as ****ing ****. Better director as well (not that the two in discussion are directors). Just view "Nil By Mouth", one of the most underrated independant films I have ever seen. You can not get any more pimp, than what he portrayed in his small role in "True Romance" either.

He was a white guy, playing a black pimp. That is ****ing ruthless.

Norton and Spacey are both better than Oldman IMO. Gary plays a very good bad-guy though...he's very sinister looking.

[Boxerdog]

Seems the people who nominated both Penn and Samantha for Oscars didn't have that same problem. In reality Penn probably emmersed himself in studying Emmett Ray, who was, as you know, a notable guitarist. In preparing for his role as Ray, I'm sure made some effort to study.


Obviously you are a guitar player, like myself. So, we're both not easily fooled. I stand by what I said, especially when you cosider what "guitar" playing normally looks like when an actor is handed the instrument for the first time.

Penn's body movement when "playing" guitar looked very much like a guitarist. He was obviously coached and was a good student, like he is with all his roles. Take a look again at Penn's entire body next time, not just his fingers. He LOOKS like a guitar player, that's why he pulls it off so well.

About the fingers, which you seem to have locked-onto, he did a hell of job, for a guy who doesn't play any instrument and has no musical training. There's times when he's a bit flat ********, but that's about all. Other than that, he's doing finger rolls, minor seventh chords, double pump strumming, and the occasional nervous tuning. That looks good to me.

We obviously saw two different films. In the print that I watched, Penn was sliding up and down the neck like he was jerking off the damned thing! As I said, I think he is a fine actor but he could have "faked" the playing better. (Finger rolls, double pump strumming??? What the hell are you talking about?? Maybe you have played longer than my 40 years! I hope to get into the "fancy ****" soon!)
And I hope to hell you are not one of those dweebs who dismiss an actor's talents simply because he could nail their girlfriend.
Gere is perhaps a "pretty boy" but he is still an accomplished actor.

[Konstantin]

Im going to have to go with Spacey on this one because i think hes a great actor but I like the movies Norton is in more.

[Moon]

Penn was sliding up and down the neck like he was jerking off the damned thing .... Finger rolls, double pump strumming??? What the hell are you talking about?? Maybe you have played longer than my 40 years! I hope to get into the "fancy ****" soon!
And I hope to hell you are not one of those dweebs who dismiss an actor's talents simply because he could nail their girlfriend.
Gere is perhaps a "pretty boy" but he is still an accomplished actor.

Not sorry we disagree, but sorry you have to get into the "dweeb" stuff. I saw Penn doing one hell of a good impersonation of Emmett Ray the guitarist, not just Emmett Ray the guy.

As far as jerking off the guitar, take another look for this ....

Finger Roll - Not fancy at all, simply roll your fingers along one string, starting with your index finger and ending with your pinky, to get four notes with one string pluck.

Double Pump - Partly strum some of the higher strings and then stall, then finish on the rest of the strings. Very common in jazz, folk, rock you name it.

Penn, like always, nails these two basic things that are not intuitive. He must have got a good music coach, who kept him from looking like the "jerk off" you describe.