Religious Question

[tyson]

religion is a personal choice and has no direct proportion to IQ or intelligence. i think many people who reject religion however, are people who have the capacity (mentally) to challenge wat they are told.

Agreed....

[aussieboxer2320]

einstein wasn't a god fan. this was in the news like a month or two ago.

beside, nobody was more intuitive and more genius than tesla - who wasn't religious at all. when asked what religion he woud be if he had to pick, he said buddhism. but he was spirtual, not religious. he new better than to get into the religious trap.

no bright person accepts the bible's form of god at least.

if a person mentions god as more of a concept, state of being, everything, or the harmony of everything, then i wouldn't disagree so much.

but the majority of reilgious people, from all religions, are merely followers who do not or cannot think for themselves. the ajority think of god as an actual person or entitiy with feelings, emotions, etc. that would mean that god has all the ****-ups normal people have. as i have said, the more u define what u thing god/universe is, the farther from it u are or seem to be. and that statement is based off of my own understanding as well as ancient philosophy.

too many people have tried to rely on the magic father figure - like the girl mentioned. truth is, u are accountable for yourself.

man thats bull**** if i ever heard it.

you say people who are religious are dumb followers??? im not dumb and i go to mass every week...my granpas been goin to mass every week for his whole life (77 years)...the majority of athiests are bitchy little whiners who think god should make life easy for them so they slander him and doubt his existence when things dont work out. it doesnt work like that, lfes meant to be hard

[tyson]

man thats bull**** if i ever heard it.

you say people who are religious are dumb followers??? im not dumb and i go to mass every week...my granpas been goin to mass every week for his whole life (77 years)...the majority of athiests are bitchy little whiners who think god should make life easy for them so they slander him and doubt his existence when things dont work out. it doesnt work like that, lfes meant to be hard

Now this is some pure and hardcore bull****.

[squealpiggy]

Also what you are not understanding is that the ancient Mesopotamians weren't a small dynasty.

The Mesopotamian empire consisted of about 4 bronze age empires and 2 iron age empires one of which was the babylonian empire. It was specifically the Babylonian empire you said that you belonged to. Besides which, it isn't a matter of size. The region was turned upside down on numerous occasions as new conquerors swept over the region. I'm not dis*****g the existence of the babylonian empire, I'm simply pointing out how infintessimally unlikely it is that you can trace your roots to it.

I also believe that you think it was made up of a few tribes when really it wasn't.

No I don't, it was a large civilisation and an empire.

The Babylonians were mentioned in many artifacts and in many writings of ancient people that were passed along (including the Old Testament or Torah if you are a ***,Christian or even ******). You should also know that one of the ancient 7 wonders of the world was in Babylon (The Hanging Gardens of Babylon), in which the Chaldean king Nebuchadnezzar built a huge garden palace for his sick wife.

All this is very impressive but doesn't change the fact that the end of the Babylonian empire came about when they were conquered, swept aside and 2500 years of turmoil followed. I personally doubt you could trace your specific ancestry back to the 7th century CE but even if you could it would be lost by the massive upheaval of the ****** conquests and the reign of the Caliphate.

The fact that artifacts and ancient writing and tablets from the oldest period in history are still in possesion by the us (Chaldean/Assyrians) which were passed by our ancestors and great grandfathers through many generations which also astonished scientists and historians, shows somewhat that we do exist today. I think the fact that roughly 4 million people speak the language of the old times (with some changes in words) and are the only people in the world to have carried on from ancient Mesopotamia is amazing considering many languages and people never made it through

The English language has altered so much in the last 1200 years that a person speaking modern English could not understand a person speaking Olde English. English is spoken as a first language by something like half a billion people. Now you are telling me that four million people are speaking a largely unaltered version of Mesopotamian from the Babylonian empire from a period twice as long ago and considerably more eventful interveneing years?

On the part about the ******s, the actually have a timeline that shows somewhat where they came about being and how they evolved over time and their geneolgy and some of their ancestors. Whether its true or not is based on how people look at it, but it doesn't mean that is cannot happen because a few scientists say so

It's possible that there are some texts existing that trace Muhammed's roots back to biblical figures but I really wouldn't lend much credence to them. It's a well kown ploy to try and lend extra weight to the claims of truth made by their followers. There were attempts made to link Jesus back to David by Christian rewriters of history so that you may have heard of something tracing ******s back to Ishmael it would likely not be too credible.

There is far too much of a vested interest in making the link by religious groups. Good scientists are motivated by finding the truth and any holes in their propositions are meercilessly ripped open in peer review. In the case of theocracy if you can put the peer reviewer to the sword for pointing out the flaws in your argument then you really don't have a failsafe system for fact checking.

the majority of athiests are bitchy little whiners who think god should make life easy for them so they slander him and doubt his existence when things dont work out..

The majority of Christians are credulous bigots who resort to threats and insults when they are faced with reason.

You see how easy, how offensive and how inaccurate it is to make statements like this? Loud mouthed adolescent atheists are as annoying to me as loud mouthed adolescent Christians. Most atheists, like most Christians, don't treat their position like it is some sort of gang.

[MindBat]

What I don’t yet grasp is how certain religious groups have announced their God-authorized appointment as the one and only group possessing the key to salvation and eternal life.

Throughout millennia, various groups have anointed themselves as the one true religious group chosen by God to help save humanity from itself as part of the minimal number of 144,000 to be chosen by God.

If there were a God chosen people picked out of the billions on the planet to lead the cause of salvation, it would stand to reason that that particular group would not easily succumb to the wicked ways of the world, and would avoid suffering sickness and disease, and the myriad forms of tragic accidents that befall all since the creation of the first human.

Their immunity would garner a larger following of supporters?with the exception of those who would still be skeptical after being presented with substantial and conclusive evidence beyond any reasonable doubt, after witnessing a multitude jaw dropping miracles, and were then smashed over the skull with a 2 x 4 for good measure. Those couldn’t be saved even if they were to be cured of mental ******ation on the spot, transformed into guinea pigs, and then back into human form.

For all intents and purposes, not much has changed as is apparent by the state of world affairs today.

[Don Corleone]

What I said is of great significance actually, because if the point is only the message Jesus was saying, not that it actually happened, then it kind of proves that the events described in the Bible are nothing more than fairy tales to make a point out of the common sense it is trying to forward.
There is nothing astonishing by saying "those who never stole anything in their life can chop of the hands of that thief".
It seems fairly obvious that the whole situation described in that passage is nothing more than a metaphor to explain in picture form the message (common sense) Jesus was trying to teach.

Who said it never happened? I didn't say that. You tend to imply that I'm making comments when I'm not. Back then, there wasn't no common sense like what Jesus was saying. It wasn't common sense to them. It might be common sense to everyone nowadays(or atleast some people) but back then it was in their law. I also think it is astonishing to say what Jesus said especially at a time with great tension with the Roman Empire, and the situations that ***s were in. I'm trying to make a point and telling you the message that Jesus was making because it seems apparent that you don't know much of Jesus IMO so the only way I can put it in words is by making a point or sending a messsage. And again, it seems common sense nowadays that you don't kill someone for commiting a sin like adultery(even as some arab states with sharia law sentence the women to death for doing it ie. Saudi Arabia) but the reason is seems normal now is because Jesus spoke out against it. He is not the only one, there have been others but he is the one who many think of when applying it

That is just plain ****ing ridiculous. I have the capability to commit murder, and therefore I should be treated as a murderer. Put on a edge, that is exactly what you (the Bible) are saying.
If God are so loving and caring and forgiving that he has to punish the entire human race for all eternity because Adam & Eve were disobidient, then I think I'm far better off worshipping someone else. Jesus.

No one said you should be treated as a murderer because you have the capabilities to sin. You have the capabilities to sin therefor you have the ability to commit murder. Adam and Eve commited sin therefor Christians imply that we are stained with original sin. I don't understand what is so difficult. Can you point out exactly to what you are not understanding

You avoid every question. Why would you believe in christianity if you didn't think the religion was better/more correct than the others?

Again, can you not read. I obviously must think that my religion is correct or else I wouldn't be of that religion. But I am not closed minded. I'm not going to say that mine is more superior because everyone has their own and with respect to mine, there have been some that are far older then mine like ******* of which Christianities roots are from. But its not about being better. That's something a kid would say. Its not about thinking yours is better or not. I don't see the term "better" when it comes to religion, and it isn't a term that should be used when it comes to religion because it is not proper for that subject, but I do believe in the word "correct" that is why you choose a religion that fits you. Its about believeing in your religion and accepting that it is the correct one for you

[tyson]

Who said it never happened? I didn't say that. You tend to imply that I'm making comments when I'm not.

You can read, but you just can't comprehend, can you?
You said it didn't matter, the point was in the message Jesus was saying.

Back then, there wasn't no common sense like what Jesus was saying. It wasn't common sense to them.

Ah, they were ****** in those days. Had no sense of understanding, compassion, love or common sense. In light of the pyramids, astronomical charts, the 7 world wonders and the like, it would be a smart assumption to suggest they had no common sense.

It might be common sense to everyone nowadays(or atleast some people) but back then it was in their law. I also think it is astonishing to say what Jesus said especially at a time with great tension with the Roman Empire, and the situations that ***s were in. I'm trying to make a point and telling you the message that Jesus was making because it seems apparent that you don't know much of Jesus IMO so the only way I can put it in words is by making a point or sending a messsage.

How much I know about Jesus is totally irrelevant to what we are saying here.
I say it is highly unlikely that Mary Magdalaine would escape a situation like that unscathed. I say it sounds like a metaphor to make it easier for children to understand and relate to what is being taught.
I understand the message Jesus was trying to forward, even though you imply that I don't get it.

And again, it seems common sense nowadays that you don't kill someone for commiting a sin like adultery(even as some arab states with sharia law sentence the women to death for doing it ie. Saudi Arabia) but the reason is seems normal now is because Jesus spoke out against it. He is not the only one, there have been others but he is the one who many think of when applying it

Here is the thing, christians claim that Jesus nullified the Old Testament, because in the OT it says that you will burn in hell for committing adultery.

No one said you should be treated as a murderer because you have the capabilities to sin. You have the capabilities to sin therefor you have the ability to commit murder. Adam and Eve commited sin therefor Christians imply that we are stained with original sin. I don't understand what is so difficult. Can you point out exactly to what you are not understanding

According to Christians, a baby is born with sin and therefore condemned to hell from day one, unless he/she converts of course.
The point I'm making is that your loving God is totally unable to forgive Adam & Eve's sin, proven by the fact that every baby is born stained with sin because of something that (never) happened 6000 years ago.

Again, can you not read. I obviously must think that my religion is correct or else I wouldn't be of that religion. But I am not closed minded. I'm not going to say that mine is more superior because everyone has their own and with respect to mine, there have been some that are far older then mine like ******* of which Christianities roots are from. But its not about being better. That's something a kid would say. Its not about thinking yours is better or not. I don't see the term "better" when it comes to religion, and it isn't a term that should be used when it comes to religion because it is not proper for that subject, but I do believe in the word "correct" that is why you choose a religion that fits you. Its about believeing in your religion and accepting that it is the correct one for you

You must believe your belief is the correct one, and that all the other beliefs are wrong and a waste of time and energy.
If you are a christian you must believe that buddhists, hindu's, ******'s etc are all condemned to hell because they are unwilling to accept Jesus as their lord & saviour.
The Bible flat out tells you these things, and yet you say that you are not close minded and that people must find a religion that is correct for them.

Are you implying that you don't care about other people's fate, or are you saying that the only thing that's important is that you have faith, not that the faith is correct?

[Don Corleone]

You can read, but you just can't comprehend, can you?
You said it didn't matter, the point was in the message Jesus was saying

I didn't say it didn't matter. I was talking about the moral of the story. Since it was evident that you don't understand what the Bible was talking about I had to put it to you in a message or in one point.

Ah, they were ****** in those days. Had no sense of understanding, compassion, love or common sense. In light of the pyramids, astronomical charts, the 7 world wonders and the like, it would be a smart assumption to suggest they had no common sense.

Again, your twisting my words and making them sound to your pleasing. Did I say they were ******? Did I even post that once. Stop sounding ridiculous just to make a point. The point is that in their times, they would stone women for commiting adultery, the same way it is done by ******s under strict law today. I even mentioned it on another thread, that the people of the ancient times were the smartest people IMO to ever walk the Earth and used what they had to work with more intelligently then any people of another period of time did. There is a difference. When there was something in their law, the "common sense" you were reffering to had nothing to do with it. It sounds weird nowadays that people would get stoned for commiting adultery but it happened and I think that you are really unaware of it noticing you little knowledge on this subject

How much I know about Jesus is totally irrelevant to what we are saying here.
I say it is highly unlikely that Mary Magdalaine would escape a situation like that unscathed. I say it sounds like a metaphor to make it easier for children to understand and relate to what is being taught.
I understand the message Jesus was trying to forward, even though you imply that I don't get it.

I think it is relevant bud. If your speaking out about a man you barely know, it doesn't help out your knowledge for such a subject. You keep bashing the Bible and dis*****g claims yet it would make sense if you had some knowledge of Jesus for a start, wouldn't you think? Also, I don't think the teachings of Jesus are just targeted for children only like you claim.

Here is the thing, christians claim that Jesus nullified the Old Testament, because in the OT it says that you will burn in hell for committing adultery.

And...? If Christians believe that Jesus is the Son of God and the foretold Messiah in the Old Testament, would it not make sense for him to do as he wanted? Do you really think Jesus would just let a women get stoned after teaching to love on another and for forgiving one another? It is highly unlikely. If he taught to forgive one another and ask for forgiveness, he would be more then happy to forgive a women for commiting adultery

According to Christians, a baby is born with sin and therefore condemned to hell from day one, unless he/she converts of course.
The point I'm making is that your loving God is totally unable to forgive Adam & Eve's sin, proven by the fact that every baby is born stained with sin because of something that (never) happened 6000 years ago.

Where does it say this. Can you please show me? And since when can a baby choose his/her own religion as such a young age? Never heard of it but if you have can you please post the link for that too? Also, who said that God is unable to forgive. Jesus taught that if you ask for forgiveness and believe him as you Lord and Saviour, you will be saved. There is only one exception. That is if you have never heard of Jesus and have never heard of the Word he was teaching about. Other then that, the Bible states that anyone can receive salvation through Jesus Christ. If your going to question Christianity, atleast to it under the right basis and with facts as to where it says what you say. You should be aware that there isn't just Christianity but other denominations that stem from it (ie. Catholicism, Orthodox, Protestant, Anglican, New Born etc...). So some have minor differences if that is what you are implying but I would still like to see some links as to who is saying this

You must believe your belief is the correct one, and that all the other beliefs are wrong and a waste of time and energy.
If you are a christian you must believe that buddhists, hindu's, ******'s etc are all condemned to hell because they are unwilling to accept Jesus as their lord & saviour.
The Bible flat out tells you these things, and yet you say that you are not close minded and that people must find a religion that is correct for them.

Are you implying that you don't care about other people's fate, or are you saying that the only thing that's important is that you have faith, not that the faith is correct?

Again, your sounding more ridiculous as we go on. I had respect for most of what you posted before this one. Ofcourse I believe my religion is the correct one. But you are unaware that there are many Hindu's and ******s as well as some Buddishts that regard Jesus as someone important and a key figure in humanity's existence (especially ******s as they see him as one of God's prophets) It does say that you must look to Jesus for eternal salvation but your posts are very ignorant and obnoxious. Am I going to go around forcing people to become Christians? It is their choice. They should see it for themselves. But I am not going to do as you suggest and bash religions. I will question them, yes, and point out where I see as false, misguiding or inaccurate teachings but I'm not going to say that whoever is not of my religion, then I don't care for them and they're going to hell. It is up to them to seek knowledge and find it and to Christians, that is through Jesus. How am I going to bash ******* when Christianity stems from it and when Jesus and his people were all ***s? How am I going to bash Hinduism when it has been here longer then Christianity and as the oldest religion practiced to date. Stop posting what you want to hear and post about what we are talking about