I think a lot of people owe Canelo an apology

[BattlingNelson]

Over 109 soccer players tested positive for clenbuterol at the 2011 FIFA Under-17 World Cup in Mexico thanks to tainted beef.

We know this is an issue in that country.

What proof do you have that Canelo took this banned substance on purpose to gain an illegal advantage?

All I know is that he tested positive for a banned substance and that it’s the athlete that bears sole responsibility.

Tell me how a hair sample makes him clean suddenly?

[travestyny]

you obviously didnt read what I or the article in question that specified that the follicle samples were sent to Wada

Dude, they weren't sent to WADA. They were sent to a WADA accredited lab. That is not the same thing. SMRTL is not WADA.

[BattlingNelson]

I don't disagree with you. He is guilty of having a banned substance in his system.

But again, the point is that 2 experts and the hair test seem to corroborate his story. Just like there is no proof that he ate tainted beef, there is also no proof that he used Clen for an advantage. But having 2 experts and this test on his side should certainly be taken into account, shouldn't it?

Conte? The convicted criminal Mexican who has been on Canelos side from day 1?

And who else?

And did they say that clenbuterol could not be in canelos body via the****utic use? Yes or no?

[travestyny]

Conte? The convicted criminal Mexican who has been on Canelos side from day 1?

And who else?

And did they say that clenbuterol could not be in canelos body via the****utic use? Yes or no?

Actually I wasn't referring to Conte, but I guess that makes 3. I was referring to Dr. Eichner and the Dr. at the press conference from the Mexican Federation of Sports Medicine.

The clenbuterol could have been in his body for the****utic use, yes. Again, Eichner said the levels were consistent with ingesting tainted beef. The other doctor said the same, and also added that at those levels, there would be no benefit. You can add in Conte's statements about the hair test and such also.

From what we know of Clenbuterol, and I'm no expert, but it seems it is used for weight loss and to improve breathing. Training camp started...what...12 days ago from what I could find. It doesn't make sense that he would be using it only in Mexico 2 months before the fight and then stop, especially when users have gone on record saying that when going off of it, weight is gained more quickly. So was his plan to keep using when he moved to America in the next week and think he could pass the tests? Or was his plan to use it only in Mexico for 12 days and then abandon it for the rest of the way?

You have to admit that this doesn't seem to add up, and when taking the testimony of these experts mentioned above, it does seem to prove what he claims. No, not definitively, but I believe it should tip an honest person more toward belief than not.

[Citizen Koba]

I know the mega-rich is getting away with a lot of ****. Where I don't agree with Shoulder is when narrows it down to a select group or family.

I tend to agree with you... I've had this discussion many times with folk who like conspiracies about the Rothschildes or various other shadowy groups, but I'm a big fan of Occams razor and you don't need that **** to explain the workings of our world. We live under an economic and political system which rewards greed and the accumulation of wealth and power beyond all other considerations be they moral, ethical or even practical matters of survival (like the destruction of the environment)... if it wasn't one family or group it'd be another. And as pointed out rather nicely by Chomsky we can scarcely call it a 'conspiracy' when the rich and powerful get together to figure out ways of getting more rich and more powerful... after all, how did they get where they were in the first place?

[BattlingNelson]

Actually I wasn't referring to Conte, but I guess that makes 3. I was referring to Dr. Eichner and the Dr. at the press conference from the Mexican Federation of Sports Medicine.

The clenbuterol could have been in his body for the****utic use, yes. Again, Eichner said the levels were consistent with ingesting tainted beef. The other doctor said the same, and also added that at those levels, there would be no benefit. You can add in Conte's statements about the hair test and such also.

From what we know of Clenbuterol, and I'm no expert, but it seems it is used for weight loss and to improve breathing. Training camp started...what...12 days ago from what I could find. It doesn't make sense that he would be using it only in Mexico 2 months before the fight and then stop, especially when users have gone on record saying that when going off of it, weight is gained more quickly. So was his plan to keep using when he moved to America in the next week and think he could pass the tests? Or was his plan to use it only in Mexico for 12 days and then abandon it for the rest of the way?

You have to admit that this doesn't seem to add up, and when taking the testimony of these experts mentioned above, it does seem to prove what he claims. No, not definitively, but I believe it should tip an honest person more toward belief than not.

Conte and others have said that clenbuterol is tremendously effective as a ped for boxers.

Thanks for acknowledging that Canelo hasn’t been cleared of anything.

[Bjl12]

It is odd how passionate some people are about this.

Canelo lives in Mexico

Canelo eats meat

Mexico has meat problem specifically with clenbuterol

This was 1st time Canelo was tested in Mexico

This is also 1st time Canelo has ever tested + for anything, ever

Urine sample (+) x 2 in February

WADA director says clenbuterol levels "consistent with meat contamination"

Hair follicle test is NEGATIVE for Clenbuterol...meaning he is NOT doping and the failed tests were likely related to actual meat contamination...



Yet people on here are crying about the specific lab where sample was collected, whether the lab tech ate McDonald's or Subway prior to testing, whether they drive a truck or sedan, and whether Breadman is a white supremacist.

While we know WonderWHITEBreadman is trash...none of that matters.

Ca$h ate some bad meat and owned it like the stud he is. Time to move on

[nacho daddy]

WADA... W ill A llow D rugged A thletes

[travestyny]

Conte and others have said that clenbuterol is tremendously effective as a ped for boxers.

Thanks for acknowledging that Canelo hasn’t been cleared of anything.

No, he hasn't been cleared of anything. I agree with you there. But the evidence when taken together makes a strong case for his contention.

Even before he failed, it was stated that he would be relocating to America in the first week of March. Why would he load up on Clenbuterol for the first 12 days of camp and then stop? It makes no sense.

Plus, at the levels that were found, if he was using it the****utically, he was clearly on his way off of it so that the levels fell to "tainted beef" level. So at 2 months before the fight, he had gained what he wanted from Clenbuterol already?


Come on, dude. It makes no sense.

[ShoulderRoll]

Was curious about that myself.. the provenance is odd.



Written by a member of the political elite as a review and critique of a different book about a conspiracy by the capitalist elite to subjugate the rest of the us, and basically saying that's a good thing. Go figure.

I got too many books on the go already and not enough time to finish 'em. I'm curious about this one... but not that curious. I already know the mega rich are basically fucking the rest of us over and many of the stratagems they use to obfusticate, numb, divide and conquer... it's countering that **** that I'm interested in now.

You have things slightly twisted.

The Naked Capitalist is a book by W. Cleon Skousen.

It is a summary and review of Dr. Carroll Quigley's "Tragedy and Hope."

Quigley was an Ivy League educated historian who essentially proves the existence of a world power elite operating behind the scenes. He is the one who seems sympathetic to their goals and oddly blind to the harm they are causing.

Skousen, on the other hand, gives his interpretation of the same evidence and is critical of the works of the cabal. And rightly so, I would say.