Mayweather's IV injection (Master thread)

[Slip Stream]

(Before I start, click the link in my signature. It has all the answers you need. Don't come back until you're done with it. Enjoy.)

Too bad that the truth always comes to the surface. It takes time, but it always comes out.
A lie has wings and the truth has feet.
That’s why a lie can fly all over town and get there first.
The truth moves slowly, but when it arrives, it can stand on its own.

Floyd fans, please....don't talk like you're unaware of all the scandals out there. You would just embarrass yourself.

Some floyd fans say "it's over, Usada and Nsac justified everything, case closed".
Are you serious or just blindly trying to win your little argument on the internet without even looking at the FACTS?
Usada and Nsac are on the same boat. They will certainly not point the gun at their head.

There are still unanswered questions by USADA

Again, Hauser's response to USADA's pdf:



And:

On his medical form, Floyd wrote that he wasn't suffering from a serious medical condition such as "severe dehydration", and didn't receive any IV injections. There's no reason for him to exclude these important details unless, of course, he was using the IVs for a purpose other than "rehydration". At least Pacquiao's medical form listed the NSAIDs he was taking that hinted towards a pre-fight injury. Floyd, oddly enough, didn't seem to want anyone knowing that he took an excess of 750 ml of saline (roughly 15 times the WADA limit) the day before the fight





(credit to IR0NFIST)

You realize this won't undo the schooling that Manny received at the hands of the arrogant Mayweather, right? I'm not sure Floyd got his money's worth if he was juicing. After all, Floyd somehow lost to a clean one-armed fighter anyway. What did Floyd get out of PEDs, the ability to catch Manny flush with straight rights, or did it give him the mythical ability to simply move instead of standing in front of Pacquiao like a nut? Dunno, it feels weird to me, all of this. It doesn't feel like a good faith effort to get to the facts of an IV, rather it seems like a naked attempt to undo a lopsided decision on the cheap.

I thought the lead-up to the fight was really bizarre in some ways as it seemed so many were completely willing to suspend all logic about boxing to have Manny beating Floyd, no matter how ridiculous it truly seemed. Manny was gifted abilities by some of his fans that he simply did not possess and that's the end of it. He lost to skills, not to drugs.

Floyd ruined their lives

Floyd stretched their vaginas so out of shape a herd of Elephants could run through them with room to spare.

You tell them!!!

Oh wait, Lance Armstrong was supposedly tested all year round and even though he and his fans said the same thing, Lance was able to use the same tricks FLoyd borrowed to beat the tests!


"It was all hard work" - Lance Armstrong

Yup you proved your point for sure, if it happened to the brazenly open Lance Armstrong it could happen to Floyd if he used an IV. Since Armstrong was perceived as a paragon of virtue, but actually wasn't, he must somehow be the standard for all athletes? Some sort of bizarre litmus test, if Lance could cheat it definitely means Mayweather is guilty as charged?

But ultimately these allegations of impropriety take away some of the sting don't they? Because if Mayweather cheated it somehow reverses the nightmare some fans created for themselves when they went "all in" with Manny. In the end, if it brings you this much comfort, I say hold on to it for all you're worth!

[ADP02]

Yup you proved your point for sure, if it happened to the brazenly open Lance Armstrong it could happen to Floyd if he used an IV. Since Armstrong was perceived as a paragon of virtue, but actually wasn't, he must somehow be the standard for all athletes? Some sort of bizarre litmus test, if Lance could cheat it definitely means Mayweather is guilty as charged?

But ultimately these allegations of impropriety take away some of the sting don't they? Because if Mayweather cheated it somehow reverses the nightmare some fans created for themselves when they went "all in" with Manny. In the end, if it brings you this much comfort, I say hold on to it for all you're worth!

Yup, you got me twice now!

Oh wait, what you said can be applied to Floyd as well! Sorry, I tried to help you again and I failed you! Sorry bro!

[Slip Stream]

Yup, you got me twice now!

Oh wait, what you said can be applied to Floyd as well! Sorry, I tried to help you again and I failed you! Sorry bro!

Hey bro, I don't need your "help," by the way but thanks for looking out though. You know who could really use your crack analytical assistance? Yup, you guessed it, Pac. Manny needs a dull but devoted contingent to give up a portion of their lives to get on internet boxing sites to try to rewrite reality in such a way that their "man feelings" won't be bruised.

I'm so sorry bro! Good luck!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[ADP02]

Again, you got called out on your nonsense. Evidence shows that Floyd said otherwise and pointed to dark urine, and over training. Rather than giving samples. Floyd said specifically that is urine was VERY dark, extremely dark. This is indicative of severe dehydration. But you conspiracy theorists wouldn't know that.

The majority of professional boxers aren't testing through USADA, but rather through NSAC. And the majority of them rehydrate via IV after the weigh-in. Commonly throwing on anywhere between 10 lbs to 20 lbs overnight. Rehydration through IV is permissible under NSAC rules, and again, it is common and standard practice in professional boxing.

We'll be waiting for you like we are waiting for Hauser's long form reply. GO!!!

Sorry bud. You are too far gone. Other Floyd fans tried those lines as well. We all know what Floyd and Ellerbe said in that interview. Again, just because I'm a patient person..........

NONE, Nada, Niente, Rien, niets,...... that Floyd and Ellerbe said adds up.

You need to take everything into account but start by understanding what "contributed to" means. Yes, this is what I would call baby steps but I think that you need to start on a task that should have been very easy for you to understand BUT YOU DID NOT!!! Once you figure out that you were wrong, then you can take on the other challenges.

I know its hard because the difficulty in all this is that you are not objective. You are trying to protect your hero Floyd. Once you are able to be relatively objective about this, all this will be much clearer to you.


Honestly, you bring up points that just help my case. The thing that I don't get is why you are not seeing it?

Again, FLoyd volunteered to do more than what you are trying to spin but then Floyd decided at one point that he just couldn't do it an opted out of it with his so called retroactive TUE. Opting out or loophole can be another name one can call this sham.

I'm sorry, but when someone states the "why's" of their severe dehydration, you do not say "I will only listen to the part that I want to hear". And that is what you are doing with that interview of Floyd and Ellerbe and all the other points that we know about this scandal. Everything Ellerbe and FLoyd said would be used for and/or against them in an investigation, for example.


We should NOT remove anything from what was said by Floyd/Ellerbe/USADA/NSAC even if they contradict their own or each other.
All Floyd mentioned was urine, workout, blood and urine BUT there would be more if Floyd experienced an excessive amount of dehydration and again, some of what he said, and in fact 3 of 4 do not make any sense. The 4th (urine) can happen to anyone including people who are not excessively dehydrated and even to non-athletes. With other valid points, I would buy all this but alone, nope!!!


What I meant above is that YOU pointed out why others may require IVs. Floyd though didn't have that issue.
In fact, Ellerbe and FLoyd have always maintained that making weight has always been easy for Floyd. This is important and also can be used against him. Also, when they took his weight at various points prior to the fight (eg. at 30 days) can also be used against him. You may say "What does making weight have to do with dehydration?" Well, experts would quickly realize that in order for Floyd to have been excessively dehydrated, it would mean that he had to have lost quite a bit of weight (fluids) BUT Floyd has been quite steady and in fact has had similar weights in past and future weigh ins AND again the key is, Floyd said its easy to make weight.




The American College of Sports Medicine (ACSM) has developed fluid replacement recommendations to help athletes limit their risk of both dehydration and overhydration. They also have a quick way to recoup from Floyd's so called "excessive dehydration". Read the last point:
•Individuals can monitor their hydration status by employing simple urine and body weight measurements. Several days of first morning body weights can be used to establish base-line body weights that represent “normal” body water levels. Body weight changes can reflect sweat losses during exercise and can be used to calculate individual fluid replacement needs for specific exercise and environmental conditions.
•Fluid replacement before exercise, if needed, is meant to start the physical activity at “normal” body water and electrolyte levels. Fluid should be consumed several hours before exercise to enable fluid absorption and to allow urine output to return to normal levels. ACSM recommends consuming beverages with sodium and/or salted snacks to help stimulate thirst or retain fluids.
•Fluid replacement during exercise is meant to prevent excessive dehydration (weight loss greater than two percent from baseline body weight) and to avoid excessive changes in electrolyte balance in order to avert compromised performance. The amount and rate of fluid replacement will depend on the individual and the activity, accounting for the opportunity to drink. Exercise-associated hyponatremia, which can occur in endurance events, is associated primarily with consuming fluid in excess of sweating rate. Individuals should develop customized fluid replacement programs that prevent excessive dehydration as well as overhydration. The routine measurement of pre- and post-exercise body weights is useful for determining sweat rates and customized fluid replacement programs. The guidelines note that consuming beverages containing electrolytes and carbohydrates often provides more benefits than consuming water alone. Learn how to calculate your sweat rate.
•Fluid replacement after exercise is meant to fully replace any fluid and electrolyte losses. If time permits, regular meals and beverages will restore normal hydration levels. Consuming beverages and snacks with sodium will help expedite rapid and complete recovery by stimulating thirst and fluid retention. Individuals needing rapid and complete recovery from excessive dehydration can drink ~1.5 L of fluid for each kilogram of body weight lost.




.

[ADP02]

Hey bro, I don't need your "help," by the way but thanks for looking out though. You know who could really use your crack analytical assistance? Yup, you guessed it, Pac. Manny needs a dull but devoted contingent to give up a portion of their lives to get on internet boxing sites to try to rewrite reality in such a way that their "man feelings" won't be bruised.

I'm so sorry bro! Good luck!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Floyd fans do this all the time. They try to deflect it by saying:

".... but Manny....."
".... but other boxers do it too"

Don't believe me? You and RadioRaheem poster did just that!


This is about Floyd. He made us wait 5+ years for this fight because he wanted a controlled environment so that nothing goes wrong and no shady business happens BUT then Floyd opts (uses a loophole) out of the program and people only know about this after the fight, including, the commissions, his opponents and the boxing fans. How convenient!!!

This is actually too funny.

[radioraheem]

Sorry bud. You are too far gone. Other Floyd fans tried those lines as well. We all know what Floyd and Ellerbe said in that interview. Again, just because I'm a patient person..........

NONE, Nada, Niente, Rien, niets,...... that Floyd and Ellerbe said adds up.

You need to take everything into account but start by understanding what "contributed to" means. Yes, this is what I would call baby steps but I think that you need to start on a task that should have been very easy for you to understand BUT YOU DID NOT!!! Once you figure out that you were wrong, then you can take on the other challenges.

I know its hard because the difficulty in all this is that you are not objective. You are trying to protect your hero Floyd. Once you are able to be relatively objective about this, all this will be much clearer to you.


Honestly, you bring up points that just help my case. The thing that I don't get is why you are not seeing it?

Again, FLoyd volunteered to do more than what you are trying to spin but then Floyd decided at one point that he just couldn't do it an opted out of it with his so called retroactive TUE. Opting out or loophole can be another name one can call this sham.

I'm sorry, but when someone states the "why's" of their severe dehydration, you do not say "I will only listen to the part that I want to hear". And that is what you are doing with that interview of Floyd and Ellerbe and all the other points that we know about this scandal. Everything Ellerbe and FLoyd said would be used for and/or against them in an investigation, for example.


We should NOT remove anything from what was said by Floyd/Ellerbe/USADA/NSAC even if they contradict their own or each other.
All Floyd mentioned was urine, workout, blood and urine BUT there would be more if Floyd experienced an excessive amount of dehydration and again, some of what he said, and in fact 3 of 4 do not make any sense. The 4th (urine) can happen to anyone including people who are not excessively dehydrated and even to non-athletes. With other valid points, I would buy all this but alone, nope!!!


What I meant above is that YOU pointed out why others may require IVs. Floyd though didn't have that issue.
In fact, Ellerbe and FLoyd have always maintained that making weight has always been easy for Floyd. This is important and also can be used against him. Also, when they took his weight at various points prior to the fight (eg. at 30 days) can also be used against him. You may say "What does making weight have to do with dehydration?" Well, experts would quickly realize that in order for Floyd to have been excessively dehydrated, it would mean that he had to have lost quite a bit of weight (fluids) BUT Floyd has been quite steady and in fact has had similar weights in past and future weigh ins AND again the key is, Floyd said its easy to make weight.




The American College of Sports Medicine (ACSM) has developed fluid replacement recommendations to help athletes limit their risk of both dehydration and overhydration. They also have a quick way to recoup from Floyd's so called "excessive dehydration". Read the last point:
•Individuals can monitor their hydration status by employing simple urine and body weight measurements. Several days of first morning body weights can be used to establish base-line body weights that represent “normal” body water levels. Body weight changes can reflect sweat losses during exercise and can be used to calculate individual fluid replacement needs for specific exercise and environmental conditions.
•Fluid replacement before exercise, if needed, is meant to start the physical activity at “normal” body water and electrolyte levels. Fluid should be consumed several hours before exercise to enable fluid absorption and to allow urine output to return to normal levels. ACSM recommends consuming beverages with sodium and/or salted snacks to help stimulate thirst or retain fluids.
•Fluid replacement during exercise is meant to prevent excessive dehydration (weight loss greater than two percent from baseline body weight) and to avoid excessive changes in electrolyte balance in order to avert compromised performance. The amount and rate of fluid replacement will depend on the individual and the activity, accounting for the opportunity to drink. Exercise-associated hyponatremia, which can occur in endurance events, is associated primarily with consuming fluid in excess of sweating rate. Individuals should develop customized fluid replacement programs that prevent excessive dehydration as well as overhydration. The routine measurement of pre- and post-exercise body weights is useful for determining sweat rates and customized fluid replacement programs. The guidelines note that consuming beverages containing electrolytes and carbohydrates often provides more benefits than consuming water alone. Learn how to calculate your sweat rate.
•Fluid replacement after exercise is meant to fully replace any fluid and electrolyte losses. If time permits, regular meals and beverages will restore normal hydration levels. Consuming beverages and snacks with sodium will help expedite rapid and complete recovery by stimulating thirst and fluid retention. Individuals needing rapid and complete recovery from excessive dehydration can drink ~1.5 L of fluid for each kilogram of body weight lost.

This is easily your worst post.

You wrote all of that and said absolutely little. You even spent half that time talking about 'contribution.' Again, you owned yourself when you stated that Mayweather and Ellerbe used giving blood and urine samples as the reason behind dehydration. But in reality, Mayweather did not use that as a reason. He first says his urine was very dark, extremely dark, and that it was probably due to over training. Dark, and extremely dark urine, is indicative of significant dehydration.

Next, you are only making a conspiracy that the Retroactive TUE was given for as a loophole, particularly to mask some phantom PED with 750 ml of saline and multivitamins. Obviously the Paramedic on-site and USADA felt it was necessary. On the WebMD website, they also indicate that hydration via IV is generally given for significant dehydration. And being that you weren't with Mayweather, you can't disprove the extent of his dehydration.

Pointing out that most professional boxers rehydrate via IV shows that it is permissible under NSAC rules. Next, it also shows that you might as well accuse 90% of professional boxers of masking PED usage since they rehydrate via IV, and by using way more quan****** than what Mayweather used. Throwing on 10 lbs to 20 lbs of fluid overnight.

[IR0NFIST]

The first thing that Ellerbe said in the video was that it was caused because Floyd works so hard, and thus got dehydrated. It was only later into the video when he also mentioned having to give samples.

The comparison is legit because in both situations your argument is pointless. You brought up your hero who lost for no good reason whatsoever.

Floyd also claimed to have worked even harder for the Berto fight, yet for some odd reason, there was no mention of him having "dark urine" or requiring excessive amounts of saline to rehydrate for that training camp.

My argument may appear pointless to someone who suffers from extreme fl0motion sickness. Since you're having such difficulty understanding the flaws in your own comparison, allow me to explain it to you in the easiest, simplest way I can imagine.

You're attempting to draw similarities between an organized, calculated procedure like USADA drug testing to the unpredictable aspects of a sparring session. Therein lies the flaw in your comparison.

[radioraheem]

Floyd also claimed to have worked even harder for the Berto fight, yet for some odd reason, there was no mention of him having "dark urine" or requiring excessive amounts of saline to rehydrate for that training camp.

My argument may appear pointless to someone who suffers from extreme fl0motion sickness. Since you're having such difficulty understanding the flaws in your own comparison, allow me to explain it to you in the easiest, simplest way I can imagine.

Your attempting to draw similarities between an organized, calculated procedure like USADA drug testing to the unpredictable aspects of a sparring session. Therein lies the flaw in your comparison.

Your point is pretty pointless since Mayweather has a history of working very hard and intensely for every fight. The only reason Mayweather mentioned his urine being dark is because a reporter (Iole) specifically asked about him needing the IV (which was originally told to him by USADA).

Your last paragraph once again makes no argument. Come back when you got some facts that's not owning yourself again.

[Slip Stream]

Floyd fans do this all the time. They try to deflect it by saying:

".... but Manny....."
".... but other boxers do it too"

Don't believe me? You and RadioRaheem poster did just that!


This is about Floyd. He made us wait 5+ years for this fight because he wanted a controlled environment so that nothing goes wrong and no shady business happens BUT then Floyd opts (uses a loophole) out of the program and people only know about this after the fight, including, the commissions, his opponents and the boxing fans. How convenient!!!

This is actually too funny.

I understand, but there's no "deflection" here, just reflection. Manny Pacquiao was more than a fighter to some, he was their repository of utter unfounded belief. Some fans looked at Manny as the one who would silence mouthy brilliance and finally put Mayweather in his place. He failed to do so. But let me be honest and admit Mayweather is a repository of sorts as well, so are all sport figures. But in this relationship of idol and fan, lest we forget, there's a euphoria that plays into our perceptions as well.

"But I think I won the fight, but I hurt my shoulder," but Mayweather had an IV....

[b00g13man]

As I said before, he constantly owns himself with his very own links!

Loooool. He is a one man sitcom.