Taylors state of mind

[grayfist]

There is a difference between getting knocked out, and getting broken down for 7 rounds, then knocked out.

Where lies the difference from the psychological standpoint?

I'm no shrink and I have not gotten near one ever, so I'm prepared to learn.

[shawn_]

Im not talking about psycological, Im talking about physiological brain damage. When they say you leave a piece of yourself in the ring, that piece you are leaving is brain tissue.

If Taylor takes this fight, he will be slurring like Tommy Hearns in 10 years time, or less.

[fabzmm]

taylor took a beating that fight. he was beat up severly for 7 rounds ive watched the fight several times he took a lot of clean straight and hard stiff jabs to his face because taylor leaves his left hand down which winky exposed just didnt have the power pavlik did to hurt him. pavlik will beat him everytime because of this.

[grayfist]

Im not talking about psycological, Im talking about physiological brain damage. When they say you leave a piece of yourself in the ring, that piece you are leaving is brain tissue.

If Taylor takes this fight, he will be slurring like Tommy Hearns in 10 years time, or less.

Oh. I guess that's an altogether different matter. I was addressing the psychological capacity of fighters to recover and cited the cases of Barrera, Frazier, Lewis, Foreman and how much time it took them to face the opponents who beat them, what happened in rematches, or in the cases where there were no rematches, how much time it took them to get back to the ring and perform in the manner that each of them did post-their-respective-traumatic experiences.

You will notice that at the end of my post that you quoted, I guessed that it varries from person to person. I said, it seems that it's a case-to-case...

Pretty early in the same post, I clearly stated that there were those who never were able to recover as there were those who did--at varrying levels.

On the matter of fighters leaving "a piece of...in the ring", I believe that applies too to the psychological effects of a violent encounter as it does to the physiological effects. Someone who lost property in a fire may not have been singed but still may suffer from psychological scars. Nothing physiological; something psychological. Doctors have come to refer to certain such cases as PTSD-- Post-Traumatic Stress Disorder-- which can also happen to a fighter who has defeated HOF-type opponents but suffers a stoppage loss, as in the case of Taylor.

As for the comparison between Hearns and Taylor, Hearns has had 67 fights--more than twice that of Taylor-- in six weight divisions. Taylor has been fighting in only one division. Taylor has been stopped only once; Hearns four times. Hearns had been in the wrong end of the punches of the likes of Hagler, Barkley, Duran, Pipino Cuevas-- people not exactly famed for light taps. The biggest puncher Taylor has faced are Pavlik... and maybe Joppy, in which case, I'll have to put in Sugar Ray Leonard in Hearns' ledger. And, if one puts Hopkins in Taylor's side of the equation, maybe I'd toss in Benitez.

7 rounds of Pavlik-Taylor= 3 rounds of Hagler-Hearns, 3 rounds of Barkley-Hearns I, 12 rounds of Barkelyj-Hearns II... that's on top of gruelling bouts with Leonard and Benitez....There's just something wrong with that equation....

AS for how much a single stoppage loss can damage a fighter, i recall the time when Foreman stopped Frazier in Jamaica, he dropped Smokin' Joe three times in the first and another three times in the second before it was over. Now, that can really damage the brain. But matters did not stop there.

When they met again some three years later, Foreman dropped Frazier twice in the fifth leading to the stoppage. Like I wrote in the post you quoted, Frazier met Ali (twice), Bugner, Ellis and Quarry in between the two meetings with Foreman. Ali far from walked over Frazier in their two fights, one of which was the Thrilla in Manila, and won over over Bugner, Ellis and Quarry. All put together, how much more damaging would all that have been compared to Pavlik's 7 rounds with Taylor?

One really violent fight, one stoppage leading to brain damage of the type that shall be severe enough to...?

[MojoHands]

Taylor is mentally broken for good. He has never represented the Middleweight crown with confidence since winning (officially) the first BHop fight. He won on the cards, but he was beat to **** mentally. I see no passion for the sport of boxing in him and he apparently doesn't even follow the sport...as the previous Middleweight "King", I find that kind of disgraceful. It just shows he's not concerned with history or legacy, which only leaves the money factor.

Plus, he will be losing the support of those who were making money off of him when he was top dog. Now, he's gonna have to depend on himself and I don't think he's able to do that. I don't see him fighting off the wolves when he's thrown into the wild. Boxing seemed to be nothing more than a means to an end, and he's got the big screen t.v. and leather couch he always wanted. If he hasn't been wise with his money, we're in for another rags to riches to rags story.

[bluemax]

I understand Taylor is demanding the same judges for the rematch that judged the first fight. After all they were paid to provide a win for Taylor and they didn't come thru. I'm sure they'll do everything possible to make it up to him...

[pesticid]

I think Taylor is fearful of Pavlik as he was fearful at the weigh-in. Taylor had never faced a real puncher like Pavlik prior to meeting him. He had something to fear. And Pavlik wasn't smaller either.

Jermain has a remote chance in a rematch only with Pat Burns in his corner. The longer Manny stays with him the worse his confidence will get. It's been getting worse and worse since Manny got on board and I don't see this trend to end any time soon unless Jermain kicks him out and have Manny as a broadcaster during his fights, which will be crazy.

[SkillspayBills]

He asked for the immediate rematch. He didn't want any tune ups and he didn't want to wait until fall of next year. He is chomping at the bit to get his belts back. It remains to be seen if his hunger can get him past the ghost.

[Jim Jeffries]

Oh. I guess that's an altogether different matter. I was addressing the psychological capacity of fighters to recover and cited the cases of Barrera, Frazier, Lewis, Foreman and how much time it took them to face the opponents who beat them, what happened in rematches, or in the cases where there were no rematches, how much time it took them to get back to the ring and perform in the manner that each of them did post-their-respective-traumatic experiences.

You will notice that at the end of my post that you quoted, I guessed that it varries from person to person. I said, it seems that it's a case-to-case...

Pretty early in the same post, I clearly stated that there were those who never were able to recover as there were those who did--at varrying levels.

On the matter of fighters leaving "a piece of...in the ring", I believe that applies too to the psychological effects of a violent encounter as it does to the physiological effects. Someone who lost property in a fire may not have been singed but still may suffer from psychological scars. Nothing physiological; something psychological. Doctors have come to refer to certain such cases as PTSD-- Post-Traumatic Stress Disorder-- which can also happen to a fighter who has defeated HOF-type opponents but suffers a stoppage loss, as in the case of Taylor.

As for the comparison between Hearns and Taylor, Hearns has had 67 fights--more than twice that of Taylor-- in six weight divisions. Taylor has been fighting in only one division. Taylor has been stopped only once; Hearns four times. Hearns had been in the wrong end of the punches of the likes of Hagler, Barkley, Duran, Pipino Cuevas-- people not exactly famed for light taps. The biggest puncher Taylor has faced are Pavlik... and maybe Joppy, in which case, I'll have to put in Sugar Ray Leonard in Hearns' ledger. And, if one puts Hopkins in Taylor's side of the equation, maybe I'd toss in Benitez.

7 rounds of Pavlik-Taylor= 3 rounds of Hagler-Hearns, 3 rounds of Barkley-Hearns I, 12 rounds of Barkelyj-Hearns II... that's on top of gruelling bouts with Leonard and Benitez....There's just something wrong with that equation....

AS for how much a single stoppage loss can damage a fighter, i recall the time when Foreman stopped Frazier in Jamaica, he dropped Smokin' Joe three times in the first and another three times in the second before it was over. Now, that can really damage the brain. But matters did not stop there.

When they met again some three years later, Foreman dropped Frazier twice in the fifth leading to the stoppage. Like I wrote in the post you quoted, Frazier met Ali (twice), Bugner, Ellis and Quarry in between the two meetings with Foreman. Ali far from walked over Frazier in their two fights, one of which was the Thrilla in Manila, and won over over Bugner, Ellis and Quarry. All put together, how much more damaging would all that have been compared to Pavlik's 7 rounds with Taylor?

One really violent fight, one stoppage leading to brain damage of the type that shall be severe enough to...?

Man Hagler/Hearns, what a damn slugfest! Yeah Taylor has a long way to go to absorb as much punishment as Hearns did over his career.

[SkillspayBills]

Look at Hearns face after the second Barkley fight, it looks like someone inflated it with air, he has definitely been through some wars.