Pac/Floyd investigation, documented punches (disputed rounds) blow by blow

[Spoon23]

Well done analysis.

After 6 or so years, my opinion hasnt really changed. I still have manny winning this fight pretty clearly - as usual, no actual rebuttals on any of these vids, only floyd fans deflecting from the cold hard facts seen in the multiple videos.

No one i have spoken to in real life actually thinks floyd won this - the only ones i see saying floyd won are obvious floyd fans on the internet and paid commentators.

Mind you, I of course scored the fight independent of the fact that manny was one-armed and denied legal medication, whereas floyd was allowed to use illegal peds. And as mentioned above, I still had manny winning, for much the same reason as we see in the videos - clear, effective punches that had floyd backing up for pretty much the entire fight.

Floyd fans know this and that is why they dont bother trying to actually dispute anything shown in the videos (then again, how can they?).

Excellent points.

This thread is Fort Knox proof who truly won that night and it's definitely not the bald dude who ran and hugged for 12 ***** rounds while having IVs to get an edge over a one armed man.. It's really academic at this point. Cheers!

[Spoon23]

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Nice quality. I don't think it was this wide for Pacquiao. I always had it a draw even without this video, but this video can at least demonstrate it being a draw moreso.

This video alone show who threw the most clean and effective punches the whole night. It's pretty mute and academic who really edged that night and it's obviously not the bald dude.

[travestyny]

This video alone show who threw the most clean and effective punches the whole night. It's pretty mute and academic who really edged that night and it's obviously not the bald dude.

Oh shlt, you are alive!


Welcome back, homie.

[blowblow]

This video alone show who threw the most clean and effective punches the whole night. It's pretty mute and academic who really edged that night and it's obviously not the bald dude.

but still, floyd fanboys are denying the truth..

[Spoon23]

Originally posted by Spoon23 View Post
Now to be clear. I know you've already answered Marquez has red flags, meaning he's tainted in your eyes. How about Floyd, does Floyd have red flags? Yes or NO?

A Yes or No answer will suffice.


No.

I REST MY CASE.






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PUSSIFIED REMINDER

But you did say you want a REMATCH Floyd before covid was an issue?

Floyd Mayweather and Manny Pacquiao announce December rematch | ESPN

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Basically lied for money to get 2M from Arabs. Harping a rematch with Pacquiao that he can't deliver. FEAR??

Floyd has turned himself into a used car sales man. He knows he can't. The first fight was a fluke win and he can't repeat that again. Just as Sleepy Joe ***** can't win another term after this fluke election win.

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[travestyny]

[ADP02]

Once again, he is saying it's a red flag and wondering why other things could not have been done. Well I've already explained to you a scenario where what USADA did would have been worthy.

The man had all the sights of Rhabdo, which affects high level athletes, and especially those who can't properly hydrate until after a weigh-in. Does that mean he had Rhabdo? I can't be sure because I don't have his medical records. But look at everything we've discussed. He wasn't having difficulty making weight. We've seen that with Stiverne (go look at his weights leading to the first Wilder fight) and Junior Dos Santos (look at his weights leading to the second Velasquez fight). He had "extremely extremely dark urine." He was reportedly dehydrated. He had injuries to (both) of his shoulders. He had decreased urine output.

All of these, particularly the dark urine and the shoulder injuries, seems to raise concern that he may have been dealing with some degree of Rhabdo. The treatment would be what...an IV. Which is exactly what he had done. It was the day before the fight. You would want to use an IV because you need to clear the stuff out so that it doesn't harm the kidneys.

Stiverne said that he knew something was wrong in the dressing room. Junior Dos Santos said he got it from "overtraining." That would tell me that this occurred or began occurring before the actual fights. Since USADA's main concern that takes priority even over catching a cheater is the health of the athlete, it makes complete sense that they would allow an IV in this instance as long as it is monitored by them.

If they wanted to help Mayweather cheat, what sense would it make to have a DCO, a Paramedic, members of the TUEC all witness or be a part of a cheating scheme, and then announcing it to the world so conspiracy theorists like you can make a big whoop over their favorite fighter losing? As much money as the people involved could make from helping the guy cheat, they could make even more from blowing the whistle. This story would be HUGE...the biggest scandal in US history and would shut down USADA completely. It wouldn't make sense to do this cheating scheme by the book by going through the process of a TUE when they could just say, "Look...slide us some money and we will just look the other way. We saw nothing. If you get busted, it's coming back to you and only you."

If Stiverne and Dos Santos could have had an IV before their fights and made sure their hydration remained up to par by drinking water thereafter, I think they would have been OK during their fights. I can't say for sure of course, but it would have definitely been better than going into the fights feeling unwell. I think USADA had just cause to allow this IV for that reason. It's as simple as that.

Why are you still bringing up people that had just finished a fight? Floyd's plan for the last few days was relaxing, watching movies, basketball, betting on basketball and "shakeout". Are you trying to convince me or perhaps yourself that we are talking about the same thing? Well, sorry but it is NOT the same thing!!! Not even close!!!

I have mentioned this even when we used to discuss Diaz. After a fight, the fighter's urine can be reported to be more concentrated for various reasons including getting his body damaged (e.g. muscles) which can affect the urines specific gravity or Creatinine levels when the DCO tests the urine. BUT back then you said that I was crazy WRONG but now I am right?


Secondly, Floyd has always maintained that all he was, was dehydrated.
Floyd would have to go to the hospital, get multiple tests from their lab. If it was in fact Rhabdomyolysis, they would have to determine the degree of the illness in order to provide the correct treatment. Then the person would be staying in the hospital and given an IV plus other various treatments depending on the severity of the damage. Careful monitoring would be important to stabilize the electrolytes, for example. They would be checking if the person had liver and kidney damage. The treatment would include providing an IV throughout the day. "Amounts of 6 to 12 liters over 24 hours are recommended." There would be much more than that if the issue was more serious, including possibly, dialysis.


Floyd's IV was more than likely given by a Boutique IV VEGAS company. Floyd probably used them before. Why else would the IV contain a vitamin coccktail? If Floyd had an illness, why was Floyd given a vitamin C coccktail IV? Like I said, this has Boutique IV company written all over it!!!! Floyd's IV was also done outside of a hospital and finished after he gave his urine test. No more IV was required! How convenient


3) You noticed that those other people that you mentioned went to the hospital? If they had Rhambo, then they would not be exercising or at least forcing the area that was damaged by a punch for several weeks or months. Floyd fought the next day!!!


4) Rhambo - Floyd is unlike those other 2 that you mentioned. While you may think that Heavyweights can weigh whatever they want, there is a plan. A good plan can include trying to hit a specific weight or range. So there is certainly a weight differential for them from DAY 1 of their training until the day they weigh-in. Floyd doesn't go thru all of that. He said so in a FightHype interview that he is NOT like others that drain their bodies 20 to 30 pounds. Floyd's weight does not fluctuate like that and his training regime stays consistent. Like Floyd said, he has been doing it for a decade and consistently training and making weight for the 147lbs weight category.


5) In Stiverne's next fight, he came in heavier. and made sure that he kept himself hydrated.
“I feel good,” Stiverne said after being checked by Nevada Athletic Commission doctors. “All that drinking water before the fight definitely helped.”

As we all witnessed, Floyd drank lots of water at the weigh in!!! You ever see Floyd without water? Check out his interviews. He drinks water even during interviews!!! Unlike Stiverne, Ariza monitored Floyd. Floyd was given multiple and different fluids after the weigh in.


6)
Electrolytes
============
In the initial stages, electrolyte levels are often abnormal and require correction. High potassium levels can be life-threatening, and respond to increased urine production and renal replacement therapy (see below).[8] Temporary measures include the administration of calcium to protect against cardiac complications, insulin or salbutamol to redistribute potassium into cells, and infusions of bicarbonate solution.[18]

So was Floyd given anything else such as insulin or high levels of salbutamol? WADA would want to know!!! It would be illegal to use and not telling WADA, not good!



7) I can continue but you get the picture. Floyd claimed to be dehydrated but everything points to that not being the case.

The expert specifically states that Floyd shouldn't have had an IV and if he did, then there should have been NO FIGHT!!!! His statements are CLEAR!!!



8) Finally, 2 EXPERTS call Floyd's and USADAs relationship bad. Well, so does USADA when it comes to Lance Armstrong. How USADA forgets!!!







.

[travestyny]

Why are you still bringing up people that had just finished a fight? Floyd's plan for the last few days was relaxing, watching movies, basketball, betting on basketball and "shakeout". Are you trying to convince me or perhaps yourself that we are talking about the same thing? Well, sorry but it is NOT the same thing!!! Not even close!!!

I have mentioned this even when we used to discuss Diaz. After a fight, the fighter's urine can be reported to be more concentrated for various reasons including getting his body damaged (e.g. muscles) which can affect the urines specific gravity or Creatinine levels when the DCO tests the urine. BUT back then you said that I was crazy WRONG but now I am right?


Secondly, Floyd has always maintained that all he was, was dehydrated.
Floyd would have to go to the hospital, get multiple tests from their lab. If it was in fact Rhabdomyolysis, they would have to determine the degree of the illness in order to provide the correct treatment. Then the person would be staying in the hospital and given an IV plus other various treatments depending on the severity of the damage. Careful monitoring would be important to stabilize the electrolytes, for example. They would be checking if the person had liver and kidney damage. The treatment would include providing an IV throughout the day. "Amounts of 6 to 12 liters over 24 hours are recommended." There would be much more than that if the issue was more serious, including possibly, dialysis.


Floyd's IV was more than likely given by a Boutique IV VEGAS company. Floyd probably used them before. Why else would the IV contain a vitamin coccktail? If Floyd had an illness, why was Floyd given a vitamin C coccktail IV? Like I said, this has Boutique IV company written all over it!!!! Floyd's IV was also done outside of a hospital and finished after he gave his urine test. No more IV was required! How convenient


3) You noticed that those other people that you mentioned went to the hospital? If they had Rhambo, then they would not be exercising or at least forcing the area that was damaged by a punch for several weeks or months. Floyd fought the next day!!!


4) Rhambo - Floyd is unlike those other 2 that you mentioned. While you may think that Heavyweights can weigh whatever they want, there is a plan. A good plan can include trying to hit a specific weight or range. So there is certainly a weight differential for them from DAY 1 of their training until the day they weigh-in. Floyd doesn't go thru all of that. He said so in a FightHype interview that he is NOT like others that drain their bodies 20 to 30 pounds. Floyd's weight does not fluctuate like that and his training regime stays consistent.


5) In Stiverne's next fight, he came in heavier. and made sure that he kept himself hydrated.
“I feel good,” Stiverne said after being checked by Nevada Athletic Commission doctors. “All that drinking water before the fight definitely helped.”

As we all witnessed, Floyd drank lots of water at the weigh in!!! You ever see Floyd without water? Check out his interviews. He drinks water even during interviews!!! Unlike Stiverne, Ariza monitored Floyd. Floyd was given multiple and different fluids after the weigh in.


6)
Electrolytes
============
In the initial stages, electrolyte levels are often abnormal and require correction. High potassium levels can be life-threatening, and respond to increased urine production and renal replacement therapy (see below).[8] Temporary measures include the administration of calcium to protect against cardiac complications, insulin or salbutamol to redistribute potassium into cells, and infusions of bicarbonate solution.[18]

So was Floyd given anything else such as insulin or high levels of salbutamol? WADA would want to know!!! It would be illegal to use and not telling WADA, not good!



7) I can continue but you get the picture. Floyd claimed to be dehydrated but everything points to that not being the case.

The expert specifically states that Floyd shouldn't have had an IV and if he did, then there should have been NO FIGHT!!!! His statements are CLEAR!!!



8) Finally, 2 EXPERTS call Floyd's and USADAs relationship bad. Well, so does USADA when it comes to Lance Armstrong. How USADA forgets!!! LOL

You don't pay attention to the things I've already said.


Both Stivern and junior Dos Santos stated that their Rhabdo stemmed from BEFORE their fight. Stiverne said he didn't feel right in the dressing room. Dos Santos said it was a result of overtraining. That means BEFORE the fight. Dos Santos didn't notice his urine until the next day. I'm sure he drank the rest of the night. Floyd wasn't going to hydrate until after the weighin. He gave his first sample before the weigh in.

If it were even suspected of being Rhabdo, it would make sense to give an IV under supervision. I've already said this.

Note this:

Immediately administer saline to patients with suspected myoglobinuria or rhabdomyolysis because early hydration is the key to ameliorate acute kidney injury.

You're asking why they would put vitamins in his IV....??? Because why not? I don't understand the significance of what you are saying. Because...vitamins help...? It was given by a paramedic. Do you think they paid off an IV boutique worker whom they had no time to vet to see if he/she would blow the whistle? Come on, now. You give these people no credit for having a brain.

Yes, Stivern went to the hospital after they fought a full fight. If his hydration was on the level before the fight, they wouldn't have had to go to the hospital. That's the point. Dos Santos DID NOT go to the hospital.

Go look at Dos Santos weight.
Junior Dos Santos vs. Frank Mir: 239
Junior Dos Santos vs. Cain Velasquez in his next fight: 239

In fact, from May 2012 (one fight before the overtraining incident) to April 2016, the highest he has weighed in is 241.

Why didn't Stiverne have to go to the hospital before for Rhabdo or any other time that he was coming in at around the same weight? He was the same weight 8 months earlier vs. Arreloa. It wasn't about his weight. Rhabdo is when muscles break down and leak some shlt into the system.

Again, you say he drank lots of water at the weighin. He wasn't able to properly hydrate until that point, which is why his first sample was extremely dark. Probably already had shlt leaking into his system and was unable to properly flush it until after. Then he has a fight the next day. It makes sense to treat him with an IV at that point. I thought I already said this.

Go look up the treatment for Rhabdo. IV Fluids.

. IV fluid with goal urine output of 250-300 mL/hour is your treatment of choice for rhabdomyolysis (1-4,36,47). Either balanced solutions (lactated Ringer’s, plasmalyte, etc.) or 0.9% normal saline can be used in the initial stages of rehydration (3,52,55)

So not sure why you are trying to add more to it.

Again, you are lying about what the expert said. First of all he said he doesn't know the details of what happened. Second, he did NOT say he shouldn't have been given an IV. He gave his opinion that he shouldn't have been fighting if it were very severe. As I've already stated, to avoid a situation like Stiverne, it makes sense to allow the IV to protect the athlete's health. Stiverne shouldn't have been fighting...but he fought. He would have been better off if he had an IV.

Finally, I'm sure USADA would love to help Mayweather but didn't want to help out cancer victim Lance. Makes perfect sense right? lol.


Hopefully I don't have to repeat myself again. Give it up.



And I have no idea what you are talking about being right about? You need to go find it, because you said a lot of dumb things in the past that you were wrong about. Don't ever remember discussing the concentration of urine after a fight with you. I do recall you getting busted saying a lot of **** about EPO that you tried to backtrack and say you didn't say. Because you pull a lot of shlt out of your ass and can't admit when you are wrong.

[ShoulderRoll]

I REST MY CASE.






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PUSSIFIED REMINDER

But you did say you want a REMATCH Floyd before covid was an issue?

Floyd Mayweather and Manny Pacquiao announce December rematch | ESPN

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Basically lied for money to get 2M from Arabs. Harping a rematch with Pacquiao that he can't deliver. FEAR??

Floyd has turned himself into a used car sales man. He knows he can't. The first fight was a fluke win and he can't repeat that again. Just as Sleepy Joe ***** can't win another term after this fluke election win.

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I countered your arguments but you couldn't handle it and left this thread for months (or is it years?)

I don't have time to keep owning someone that leaves the battlefield every time he gets his teeth kicked in.

Floyd beat Pacquiao. And all your spastic ramblings will never change that.

Enjoy your little thread. Deuces!

[Spoon23]

I countered your arguments but you couldn't handle it and left this thread for months (or is it years?)

I don't have time to keep owning someone that leaves the battlefield every time he gets his teeth kicked in.

Floyd beat Pacquiao. And all your spastic ramblings will never change that.

Enjoy your little thread. Deuces!

Know when you got fuvked sideways and behind bud.. It's been over for you a long time ago.. You are just too dumb not to see where you fuvked up.

I was just been busy during the Pandemic and had no time for boxing in my life..

Now that I have some free time to play with you. I'm back to fuvk you up some more hehe!


In the immortal words of Jen Psaki..

LET'S CIRCLE BACK.

Because if we use your logic he has never failed a drug test. So that means he must be clean, right?

You really have a bad case of comprehension disorder. That is your point of view not mine. In your world just because one has passed all drug test he must be clean. In my world you go deeper than just the drug testing, the facts that show red flags.. Which you have now concurred that Marquez must be a cheat. A few pages back you said Marquez was clean in your eyes. You just had to eat all your words

In my opinion Marquez was clean.

Now to be clear. I know you've already answered Marquez has red flags, meaning he's tainted in your eyes. How about Floyd, does Floyd have red flags? Yes or NO?

A Yes or No answer will suffice.

You keep on saying Marquez is clean since he never failed a drug test. You said Floyd is clean since he never failed a drug test, then by your premise Pac is clean since he never failed a drug test too? Do you get where you fuvked up??




By order of the court. Due to the lawyers of Pacquiao requesting to release Floyd's failed drug tests. Floyd has no choice but to pay Manny for defaming him. Who's been caught red handed here? If you are clean you don't have to pay, but Floyd paid.. This is academic.




LAS VEGAS -- A federal judge has ordered boxer Floyd Mayweather Jr. to pay about $114,000 for avoiding questioning from rival fighter Manny Pacquiao's lawyers in a defamation case.

Originally posted by Spoon23 View Post
Now to be clear. I know you've already answered Marquez has red flags, meaning he's tainted in your eyes. How about Floyd, does Floyd have red flags? Yes or NO?

A Yes or No answer will suffice.


YOUR ANSWER: No.

But the thing is.. By order of the court. Due to the lawyers of Pacquiao requesting to release Floyd's failed drug tests. Floyd has no choice but to pay Manny for defaming him. Who's been caught red handed here? If you are clean you don't have to pay, but Floyd paid.. This is academic.




LAS VEGAS -- A federal judge has ordered boxer Floyd Mayweather Jr. to pay about $114,000 for avoiding questioning from rival fighter Manny Pacquiao's lawyers in a defamation case.

STAY DOWN.