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Holmes vs Liston

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    Holmes vs Liston

    I side with Liston. Holmes is one of the few guys I give a genuine chance against Sonny which shows how highly I rank both guy's abilities.

    The battle of the jabs would be interesting. Sonny's is more authoritative and carries much more power and dominance, whereas Holmes has a quicker, sharper jab. His is between Sonny's and Ali's. He'd sometimes paw with it to set up the right hand too. Holmes could win rounds with the jab, Sonny could win the fight with it, by KO. Holmes also had a super quick right hand in his @rsenal, along with incredible powers of recuperation and good lateral movement. The thing with those powers of recuperation, is that he needed to use them a little bit too often for me to pick him over Liston. Shavers was a huge puncher but let's not pretend he was any kind of skilled boxer. He shouldn't have hit Larry in the first place. If Shavers could nail him once, Sonny could do it several times. He also got shaken up by the likes of Witherspoon and Snipes. He came back at them, but if they can shake him up and almost stop him just imagine what Sonny Liston left hook could do.

    Now Sonny couldn't nullify Holmes' jab completely, I'm not sure anybody could, but with his underrated defensive head movement (as displayed against Williams often under appreciated quick left hand) he wouldn't be eating Larry's left glove all night like some limited brawler. His own jab would be making it hard for Larry to establish anything. Holmes knows Sonny can hurt not just with either hand but with pretty much any punch.

    I see the fight being there to win for both guys. Holmes can't get too punchy or Sonny knocks him out of the ring, so Liston wins rounds by being assertive and Holmes nicks his rounds by being quick and moving. I don't see Liston getting stopped. Larry could hit but Liston at his best could go the distance with a broken jaw. He was stopped when way, way past his best and totally exhausted and against Ali, but that's another story in itself.

    In the 11th, with Holmes having used his legs for as much as possible during the fight (the only sure fire way to beat Liston) he stands still for a moment too long and gets sat down by a long Liston left hook that would knock out most guys. Holmes rises, groggily, but he's up. The difference between most guys who hurt their opponent and Liston is that most guys swing swing swing with everything they've got. A guy as brave and with the survival instinct of Holmes can avoid that. Unfortunately for Holmes, Liston didn't. He kept his bombs precise and rarely missed/wasted a punch when he was performing an execution and I think he'd show this against Holmes. Liston KO11.

    #2
    Interesting match up if it could have happened, but I think that I agree with you in giving an edge to Sonny. Larry was just never a go for the kill kind of guy. He had Spinks out on his feet, and let him get away instead of throwing the right hand with murderous intentions.

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      #3
      Definitely a good fantasy matchup. I think Holmes would have fought a smart, sensible fight against Liston -- and he likely would have lost against the late 50s version. Ali was able to overwhelm the older Liston with a hypnotic blazing new talent that was about to change the world. I'm not sure that a prime Liston would have lost to much less.

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        #4
        Holmes wins, out jabs out points and survives the power like he did vs shavers, I see it as Larries hardest fight bar Tyson tho, and he could well get finished by Sonny, he just seems to be smart enough and durable enough to survive the punchers, and although boxing wise its cloee I see Larry's speed advantage as too much
        Last edited by AlexKid; 03-16-2016, 06:42 AM.

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          #5
          Ol' sunken chest may take a huge fisting, but has the more honored legacy anyway. There is a question whether Larry could even get through big cat Williams as a test, but I believe Sonny could beat any of Larry's prime victims with ease.

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            #6
            One of the main differences between the men is Holmes has a much better opponent caliber than Liston. I also feel that Holmes does everything better than Sonny with the exception of power shots! Power can be a deciding factor in any match up and more so in the heavyweight class. I think Holmes would be smart enough to understand he can not stand in front of Liston and trade early in the bout.
            I believe Larry is a step above Sonny but that doesn't mean that match up wouldn't have fans drooling........... big fight, lots of fire!
            Holmes via decs.

            Ray.

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              #7
              Liston had a good jab but he wouldn't land it. Holmes movement would negate that. Holmes own jab would bust Sonny up.

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                #8
                Originally posted by Ray Corso View Post
                One of the main differences between the men is Holmes has a much better opponent caliber than Liston. I also feel that Holmes does everything better than Sonny with the exception of power shots! Power can be a deciding factor in any match up and more so in the heavyweight class. I think Holmes would be smart enough to understand he can not stand in front of Liston and trade early in the bout.
                I believe Larry is a step above Sonny but that doesn't mean that match up wouldn't have fans drooling........... big fight, lots of fire!
                Holmes via decs.

                Ray.
                Holmes, though, also had a severe case of I'm the baddest mofotker you ever seen. He might learn to stay away from Liston during the fight but I don't see the ego of his prime according anyone that much respect out of the gate. He usually had to get tagged first. True, Larry might outclass him right down the line. One thing for certain, Larry could not run as fast as Ali or fight as well on the run.

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                  #9
                  Liston has never defeated anyone half the level in his prime like Holmes. Larry would have little problems avoiding Listons one dimensional attack of straight forward lunging jabs. Holmes also had one of the best chins in the history of boxing ,not to mention Liston with an 83 inch or so reach would still be a few inches shorter about 3 inches than Holmes who fights tall so Liston would not like that because he's used to being the significantly bigger man ,and they are about the same weight around 210/215 ,and actually I think a 225 pound Holmes fares better here. Larry Holmes wins comfortably by decision win ,possibly even k.o if he follows up after the jab that Liston would have no answer for because the speed difference would be that far apart. most will point to the spinks fight but spinks had speed and made Holmes cometo him and had awkward style,in a fight I thought he lost anyway in the rematch.also Holmes was not fit in the first fight and not medically cleared really. The Holmes that fought Cooney or Holyfield beats Liston.I might even take the 52 year old Holmes who beat Butterbean, did anyone see those damaging shots Holmes landed that a far less chinned fighter would not have taken? I see no version of Liston I would feel comfortable taking over Holmes.
                  Last edited by juggernaut666; 03-17-2016, 08:36 AM.

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                    #10
                    Originally posted by juggernaut666 View Post
                    I might even take the 52 year old Holmes who beat Butterbean

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