A case for the older generation hw's

[Scott9945]

To the hard core boxing fan base he did struggle. I think this is where the blooming emergence of internet media really shine in that posters are finally able to voice their thoughts when they really couldn't during the 90's and early 2000's(not to the extent they can now)

What I mean is.... Lewis dominated Tyson.. winning every round with the exception of the 1st.. but a lot of my Uncle's friends at his boxing gym all were saying they thought Lewis looked tentative and was definitely past prime.

I'm pretty sure if NSB existed back during the Lewis-Tyson fight (or if it did there was no way it's like it is now) a lot of posters would point out the fact that Lewis looked slow, stagnant, and was unable to throw any meaningful combinations. Bad bad signs against a corpse Tyson.


Lewis dominated Tyson... Wlad dominated Povetkin but from both fights you could tell their time was/is almost up and they showed numerous flaws in their games due to age from Lewis and probably age from Wlad.

I will not be shocked to see Wladimir have his own 'Vitali tko6 moment' next year.. the difference is that Wlad isn't the fighter/cutter Lewis is.. and will probably get KTFO instead of getting a 6th round stoppage.

I actually agree with most of your comments, except that to me WK didn't struggle. That's the way he deals with aggressive fighters. It's planned and trained for, so basically Wladimir was able to dictate the action and neutralize Povetkin. Anyone that big isn't going to look good if he is backing up. It was ugly, but so are many Andre Ward and Bernard Hopkins fights.

But Wladimir is in his late 30's, has had over 60 pro fights, and obviously vulnerable because of his history. His number will soon be up and you probably can make some money betting on it.

[StarshipTrooper]

I can see Klitschkos having a fair chance against every other champ in the past, that’s probably how good they are.
But Klitschkos don’t move as well as Ali or Holmes, so one fight I had liked to see any of the bros taking part in would be against “the hardest one-punch hitter ever” Earnie Shavers. How would Vitali or Wlad have reacted if Earnie had been able to connect just once?

Damn, I misjudged you! That's a pretty damn level-headed post. Green K given :cool9:

[WladsChin]

What will Wlad do if Ali slaps him though at weight in?
Call him a Ukrainian Toilet?

[Humean]

Tyson, holyfield, lewis, ali, holmes, jack johnson, and maybe tunney would beat the klits..

klits would beat dempsey, liston, marciano, bowe, and maybe frazier,

In terms of who would have a more than 0.5 probability of beating either of the Klitschko's i'd agree with this apart from I think Tunney and Johnson. Also Bowe in his very best years maybe and Holyfield close to 50/50.

What about 70s Foreman?

[Sugar Adam Ali]

In terms of who would have a more than 0.5 probability of beating either of the Klitschko's i'd agree with this apart from I think Tunney and Johnson. Also Bowe in his very best years maybe and Holyfield close to 50/50.

What about 70s Foreman?

I think 70s foreman knocks out wlad,,,

I think george vs vitali would be an absolute war much like lennox vs vitali.. I think it comes down to if george gasses out or vitali gets injured or cut.. i would favor george slightly but think the longer the fight goes it favors vitali, as george didnt have much ring generalship like he did in his comeback years...

[Panthershock]

I dont think Wlad beats Frazier or Foreman. Yes, Steward made him a much better fighter then when we saw him beat earlier in his career. Still I think he'd be overwhelmed by both of them. Frazier with the workrate and Foreman with the early power.
Vitali I believe would beat Frazier and Foreman as hes shown more durability. Bad style matchup for Frazier. George wasn't disciplined enough in his prime.
I'd also take Liston over Wlad, but think Vitali gives him problems.

I think Wlad is a tougher matchup for a postprime Ali or Homes than Vitali would be, though I'd still go with Ali and Holmes. Wlad and Vitali both make for an awkward fight for those 2, Wlad has better speed and would be tougher to establish the outside jab against then Vitali.

Norton is an interesting matchup for either. Norton does well with outside jabbing fighters but struggles with power fighters who forced him to back up. Vitali/Wlad both have the power, but don't press like Foreman, Shavers or Cooney. Not sure how that would go

Marciano doesn't bode well against either, not explosive enough and size is a factor here when they tie up, wearing Rocky down.

Louis is too skilled and versatile for either Klitschko. Tyson is too much speed and power early, Vitali has a decent chance though. Holyfield has too much skill and energy.

as for Wladimir-Povetkin, Wlad struggled or didn't depending on the perspective you take. On the fight itself, no he didnt struggle as he won an easy decision. But he did look like a fighter who's lost a step. Yes he neutralized Povetkin's attack with the clinching, but a few years ago he wouldn't have been forced to hold so much. He would have pounded Povetkin from the outside and finish him in the mid rounds.

[Panamaniac]

'Older Generation' HW Allstars

Ranking 10 fighters who are/were superior to the Ukrainian Siblings

1. Joe Louis
2. Muhammad Ali
3. Mike Tyson
4. Larry Holmes
5. George Foreman
6. Joe Frazier
7. Rid**** Bowe
8. Evander Holyfield
9. Lennox Lewis
10. Ken Norton

[rightsideup]

Ranking 10 fighters who are/were superior to the Ukrainian Siblings

1. Joe Louis
2. Muhammad Ali
3. Mike Tyson
4. Larry Holmes
5. George Foreman
6. Joe Frazier
7. Rid**** Bowe
8. Evander Holyfield
9. Lennox Lewis
10. Ken Norton

I would add Liston and Rocky to your list to even out to a dozen

[Panamaniac]

I would add Liston and Rocky to your list to even out to a dozen

Valid point. For that matter, one could add 8 more. Fact is, I only do top 10 lists. I wrote down the first 10 that came to mind and ranked 'em. Had Liston or Rocky occured to me before any of the others, he/they would've been included.

[Sugar Adam Ali]

Ranking 10 fighters who are/were superior to the Ukrainian Siblings

1. Joe Louis
2. Muhammad Ali
3. Mike Tyson
4. Larry Holmes
5. George Foreman
6. Joe Frazier
7. Rid**** Bowe
8. Evander Holyfield
9. Lennox Lewis
10. Ken Norton

I would add Liston and Rocky to your list to even out to a dozen

I would also add jack johnson,, not sure about norton especially vs vitali