Beterbiev vs these past heavyweights

[billeau2]

QueensburyRules simply derives more entertainment baiting with absurdity than he does receiving and dispensing solid boxing facts and antidotes. No harm in that, I recon (??).

Ali and Frazier are silly match-ups for any fighter active in 2024, save for Usyk and Fury (IF Fury still has it, which we'll judge in December).

Zora Folly, 6'1", 207, was prime in 59 - 62 and remains one of the best contenders to never win the world title.

Ernie Terrell was rock solid and 6'6".

Just as silly.

Probably not worth my time to respond?

Well a useful foil can serve a purpose. Queenie by stepping init ever time is a very useful foil. He then conveniently invents a grand conspiracy. In this case? I think people should look at two fundamental truths regarding size and weight, and we can thank Queenie's ignorance for giving us a reason to look at these... The Canadian "Loon" (a coin) is not the only useful loon to have:

1. strictly speaking weight is a measure of specific mass or density per volume. Meaning that things like water weight, fat, muscle and bone all have different densities per any area they take up. Someone weighing a lot could be due to a lot of different qualities not related to size. So a weight that has a range of around 10 even 20 pounds is a very imprecise measure of relative size. I could even rehydrate to such a weight...

2. The best way to judge size in proportion to weight is to use a range of weights. So if we take a fighter that can weigh in anywhere from 190 to 250 pounds, we can then compare that scale to another fighter who has a range of weights as well. Beterbiev can weigh between 170 and perhaps 210 or so. Marciano could weigh anywhere from around 180 to 220 or so... at least from historical records. Dempsey likewise about the same range, perhaps a little bigger on the low end (190). using such a scale shows us a fighter's real weight, as it actually varies, a fighter's preference, and is a better indicator of true size.

[JAB5239]

Well a useful foil can serve a purpose. Queenie by stepping init ever time is a very useful foil. He then conveniently invents a grand conspiracy. In this case? I think people should look at two fundamental truths regarding size and weight, and we can thank Queenie's ignorance for giving us a reason to look at these... The Canadian "Loon" (a coin) is not the only useful loon to have:

1. strictly speaking weight is a measure of specific mass or density per volume. Meaning that things like water weight, fat, muscle and bone all have different densities per any area they take up. Someone weighing a lot could be due to a lot of different qualities not related to size. So a weight that has a range of around 10 even 20 pounds is a very imprecise measure of relative size. I could even rehydrate to such a weight...

2. The best way to judge size in proportion to weight is to use a range of weights. So if we take a fighter that can weigh in anywhere from 190 to 250 pounds, we can then compare that scale to another fighter who has a range of weights as well. Beterbiev can weigh between 170 and perhaps 210 or so. Marciano could weigh anywhere from around 180 to 220 or so... at least from historical records. Dempsey likewise about the same range, perhaps a little bigger on the low end (190). using such a scale shows us a fighter's real weight, as it actually varies, a fighter's preference, and is a better indicator of true size.

BOOM, ****, WHAP!!! Spot on. And let's not forget the fact there is no such thing as a time machine. Put those earlier generations being being born in modern times, they'd be bigger. Put today's ge eration being born back then, they're gonna be smaller. Medicine, nutrition and environmental factors all play a part.

[Biledriver]

Well... I was told he wears a beanie to cover "the wire" coming up through his head. I just thought maybe he was a :who" from Dr Seuss' "Whosville" but that explains it.

That wire is the coat hanger still stuck in his prefrontal lobe

Biledriver

[JAB5239]

Anyone's think beterbiev would beat the Jones who fought Ruiz. Or the best heavyweight version of James Toney? I'm just curious.

[IronDanHamza]

Anyone's think beterbiev would beat the Jones who fought Ruiz. Or the best heavyweight version of James Toney? I'm just curious.

Roy Jones, no.

I doubt any version of Toney could beat Beterbiev.

[IronDanHamza]

QueensburyRules simply derives more entertainment baiting with absurdity than he does receiving and dispensing solid boxing facts and antidotes. No harm in that, I recon (??).

Ali and Frazier are silly match-ups for any fighter active in 2024, save for Usyk and Fury (IF Fury still has it, which we'll judge in December).

Zora Folly, 6'1", 207, was prime in 59 - 62 and remains one of the best contenders to never win the world title.

Ernie Terrell was rock solid and 6'6".

Just as silly.

Probably not worth my time to respond?

Not sure why any one takes the time to respond to him at this point.

It's become increasingly obvious that he's saying absurd, outlandish things for no other reason than to get a reaction. Anyone responding is merely giving the weirdo what he wants.

[JAB5239]

Roy Jones, no.

I doubt any version of Toney could beat Beterbiev.

I think the Cruiserweight Toney beats him comfortably. Artur is pretty basic. He just applies pressure and hits hard. Toney has proven he could take true heavyweight power, and looked his best while at cruiser.

[Nash out]

Nash played these fight out on the Nash machine and Beterbiev won all four fights, before suffering a KO loss to the current version of Chisora. He then rebounded with an easy one by beating Michael Spinks from the Tyson fight in 15 seconds (including the 10 count) before a rematch with Ali resulted in a split-draw. Good fights. Kudos to Chisora. Nash out - His Excellency

[IronDanHamza]

I think the Cruiserweight Toney beats him comfortably. Artur is pretty basic. He just applies pressure and hits hard. Toney has proven he could take true heavyweight power, and looked his best while at cruiser.

Don't think he "looked his best" at Cruiserweight at all. He had one fight there against a hype job in Jirov who beat 0 ranked fighters in his career and won a competitive decision against him.

Jirov obviously being levels below the fighter Beterbiev is.

I don't see how you could possibly argue that any version of Toney "comfortably" beats a fighter on the level of Beterbiev. He didn't beat any elite fighter comfortably at any point of his career let alone one the level of Beterbiev and regularly couldn't even beat unranked journeyman comfortably. Can't see any logical reason to think it would suddenly start there.

I also don't think Beterbiev is a "basic" fighter at all. Especially not in comparison to Toney who is quite the basic fighter himself.

[JAB5239]

Don't think he "looked his best" at Cruiserweight at all. He had one fight there against a hype job in Jirov who beat 0 ranked fighters in his career and won a competitive decision against him.

Jirov obviously being levels below the fighter Beterbiev is.

I don't see how you could possibly argue that any version of Toney "comfortably" beats a fighter on the level of Beterbiev. He didn't beat any elite fighter comfortably at any point of his career let alone one the level of Beterbiev and regularly couldn't even beat unranked journeyman comfortably. Can't see any logical reason to think it would suddenly start there.

I also don't think Beterbiev is a "basic" fighter at all. Especially not in comparison to Toney who is quite the basic fighter himself.

Jirov beat 3 Cruiserweight top 10 contenders and was the number 1 Cruiserweight for 3 years. He was also an Olympic silver medalist. I think "hype job" is a little harsh. Vasily was an extremely good body puncher who threw non stop. He didn't have Beterbiev's power, but I'd hardly say he was levels below him. In fact I think it would be an incredible fight that either man could win.

Beterbiev comes straight ahead pawing with shots looking to land his bombs. This plays right into the Cruiserweight Toney's hands. Toney was excellent defensively, and as a counter puncher.

No doubt Toney took fights off. But when he was focused and at his best he was a handful for almost anyone.

I know you don't like Toney, but he was a much more skilled fighter than Artur. Beterbiev certainly has more focus and discipline though.

Beterbiev is a strong tough guy, but it's my opinion that the Toney that fought Jirov would pick him apart, just like he did Jirov. Maybe even easier because Artur wouldnt be throwing thr same volume of punches as Jirov. Who knows though.